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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 11:23 am 
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Victor IV
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Location: Holy Loch in Argyll and Bute
Quote:
Cannot say I have ever seen a Wilson horn without the collar except for the Bond Cascades


Well, your WHM above hasn't got the aluminium collar around the end! Nice condition horn, by the way.


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 11:56 am 
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Victor II
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2009 8:17 am
Posts: 299
The collar/elbow is there, it is under the paper.
Thanks for the input on the conversion. I do now believe it was probably converted by EMG.


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 6:17 am 
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Victor IV
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Quote:
The collar/elbow is there, it is under the paper.


With great respect to you, no it isn't!

I am referring to the large aluminium collar that wraps around the OUTSIDE of the "elbow" so it is visible on the external face of the horn, as seen typically on the later Mark 8. The horn you have pictured simply has an internal brass elbow that is papered over. No support collar.


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 10:01 am 
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Victor II
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2009 8:17 am
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Really, I'm intrigued, something I have not seen. All my Wilson horns with a bend have the brass elbow under the paper and no collar on the outside.
I've scoured the Internet and my large selection of images and come up with a blank.
Any chance of a picture?.


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:23 pm 
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Victor IV
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Location: Holy Loch in Argyll and Bute
I'll have to dig out one of my images from an old CDR and add it here later when I find it. I had a Mark 8 horn at one time with the collar and assumed that they were quite common things. Maybe they're a lot rarer than I thought!


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:41 pm 
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Victor I
Joined: Thu Feb 14, 2013 12:49 pm
Posts: 141
Location: Yorkshire, UK
The couple of Mark 8's I've seen have both had what Steve describes. It is what stops the horn from sitting further down in its socket.

Here's a picture of one...
http://phonautographist.blogspot.co.uk/ ... graph.html


I think having something called "the Wilson Horn Model" is a little confusing when other models have a Wilson Horn! I know you chaps know what you're talking about, but without an illustrated list of models to hand it can be confusing.

It would be great if this website had a wiki section where people could collaborate on illustrated lists of gramophone models. I've thought about adding starting an EMG list on wikipedia, but they don't like lists and sometimes delete them, so it could be wasted effort. If it was possible to do it here, I think it would have a better chance of surviving and growing.

Cheers,
David.


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:43 pm 
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Victor IV
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My CDR's are all corrupted - darn digital technology rubbish! However, I did manage to wrestle ONE picture out of 200 odd from a random list of file numbers (none are named) from one disc and, would you believe it, look what I found!

BINGO! One from me 'orn collection of yesteryear! I note David has beaten me to it anyway. Nice one, David!

Cheers,

Steve


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:53 pm 
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Victor IV
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Location: Holy Loch in Argyll and Bute
David, to answer you specifically, the Mark 8 has the horn as in my picture above. Well, most do anyway. The Mark 8 also has the 'U' tube connecting the tone-arm to horn. This conduit is hidden beneath the motor board and is evidenced by the fact that the horn plugs in some distance away from the arm which is also in conventional table/cabinet model position. ie pointing downwards at the end and fixed to an arm or motor board. The Wilson Horn models ALL had the arm inverted like an HMV/Victor horn machine and the Wilson Horn plugged right into it via a connecting ring mounted in a piece of timber which formed part of an upstand / back shelf, as in Chunny's picture / machine. This block of timber and mounting ring took the same role as the conventional HMV back-bracket. So a WHM is really an early EMG attempt at an HMV set-up. The Mark 8 was a later more sophisticated design with that 'U' tubing and copied the equally strange HMV Model 32 of the previous year (1927).

My picture above shows the Wilson Horn fixed to a Mark 9 base! Confused? Agh, well.......Anyway, the Mark 9 base has the same arrangement as the Mark 8 except that part of the tubing is visible as it protrudes from the side of the cabinet before returning to its upright position. If you imagine the entire tubing from the Mark 9 base above was shifted slightly to the right so it sat entirely within the cabinet, you would have a Mark 8 configuration.

HTH

Steve


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:13 pm 
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Victor II
Joined: Tue Jun 30, 2009 8:17 am
Posts: 299
I see what you mean by the collar now. I always assumed it was part of the cabinets not the horn as all my horns do not have it.
Even in Frank's book it's now plane to see that the later models have the collar. Where are my glasses?. Steve your picture looks like it's a MK IX case.
Thanks for the pictures, it's always great to see a different EMG.


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 Post subject: Re: EMG Conversions
PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 7:33 am 
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Victor III
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Location: near Utopia, UK
epigramophone wrote:
Looking again at Frank James' book recently, I was reminded that one of the ways in which EMG weathered the depression years was by convering customers' own cabinet machines of various makes to the EMG acoustic system.

Although I have seen and heard many original EMG machines, I have never seen one of the conversions and wonder whether any have survived.

Has anyone else seen one, or better still, has anyone else got one which they could show us?

Here is my Mk Xb, an original EMG conversion of a large Orchorsol gramophone.


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