HMV table machines post-1929: what kind of horn?

[epigramophone]

Herewith, for comparison, is the horn of a Model 109: longer overall and (unlike that of the 130) laterally symmetrical at the mouth, but obviously more convoluted and I think shallower, since it has to pass under the motor rather than round it.

I now run this machine with a 5B sound-box, which cost half as much as the gramophone itself but has proved a thoroughly worthwhile investment. The original No. 4 (a good example of its kind) still had some of the penetrating quality of the old Exhibition, giving the impression (I know I am speaking unscientifically) that the sound-waves were being forcibly projected out of the horn instead of propagating naturally – a quality which has its own kind of excitement, especially when applied to the higher brass or to a strong voice, but which is nonetheless fundamentally artificial. By contrast, the 5B allows me to forget that I am listening to an acoustic reproducer, so that I can feel there is nothing between me and the record; and this is something I have not experienced for half a lifetime. How nearly this approaches the standards of the Model 130 is of course more than I can say (likewise, I have never directly heard an EMG or any of the big post-1929 internal-horn machines), but I think it will serve for the rest of my life.

I have recently joined the CLPGS too. I was very happy with my 109 (and have a 5b soundbox which fits it, although I usually use the No 4 it came with) and still am but there's no doubt the 104 and especially the 130 are better. The 109, in turn, is better than the 110 and 125 I have, both of which have a No 2 soundbox and are completely out of their depth with electrical recordings. There is definitely an evolutionary improvement over time. I'm now after a 157 (or better still, a 'proper' re-entrant 163). I may not get financial planning permission for the latter!

If I was looking for a cabinet machine with a full size horn (i.e. not one which is effectively a table model with record storage beneath) I would not restrict my search to HMV when there are good alternatives which can be bought for a fraction of the price. Pictured below are :

1) My Salon Decca Model 72, reluctantly sold to make room for......

2) My Micro-Perophone Chromogram Model 23a which I still own and which was my every day player until I bought my Expert Minor.

3) A friend's Plano-Reflex Columbia Model 133a.

[bulleid_pacific]

Very good advice, and I will keep my eyes open. I very much like the look of the Columbia. The Decca is a good looking machine too. But there is so much less information on brands other than HMV, especially since we were spoiled by the Oakley/Proudfoot epic. Is the Columbia a post-merger EMI product? It looks it. The HMV brand has a mystique which definitely keeps the prices high - I'm certainly affected by an affection for Nipper, even though I'm sure other machines are also excellent..... HMV 157s can often be found for reasonable money, though - they seem to have sold well so there are quite a lot of survivors. I suppose my real hang-up is that I have 11 HMVs and 1 Columbia at the moment - and the Columbia seems out of place! I'll get over it, no doubt.

[Menophanes]

Fortunate people, who can seriously contemplate introducing another floor-standing machine into your homes! I cannot; these images may suggest why.

Oliver Mundy.

[epigramophone]

Very good advice, and I will keep my eyes open. I very much like the look of the Columbia. The Decca is a good looking machine too. But there is so much less information on brands other than HMV, especially since we were spoiled by the Oakley/Proudfoot epic. Is the Columbia a post-merger EMI product? It looks it. The HMV brand has a mystique which definitely keeps the prices high - I'm certainly affected by an affection for Nipper, even though I'm sure other machines are also excellent..... HMV 157s can often be found for reasonable money, though - they seem to have sold well so there are quite a lot of survivors. I suppose my real hang-up is that I have 11 HMVs and 1 Columbia at the moment - and the Columbia seems out of place! I'll get over it, no doubt.

With the exception of the 201 and 202 portables, the Columbia Plano-Reflex machines were rapidly phased out after the EMI merger, so the machine pictured is unlikely to date after 1931 and will be of 100% Columbia origin.

HMV 157's are easily found and relatively cheap, although a good one will usually cost more than a Columbia or a Decca. 157's play well, but their cabinet design is particularly drab and uninspired. Remember that you are likely to spend more time looking at your machine than listening to it.

The reason why there is so much information on HMV is that their archives were carefully preserved before and after the 1931 merger. The same care was not taken with Columbia, and I suspect that the HMV men were only too happy to suppress the history of what had been their biggest competitor. No-one can now write a comprehensive reference book on Columbia machines because the original source material no longer exists.

[OrthoFan]

room_01_small.jpg

standard_b_and_109.jpg

Fortunate people, who can seriously contemplate introducing another floor-standing machine into your homes! I cannot; these images may suggest why.

Oliver Mundy.

I can certainly see your point. If moving to larger accommodations is not possible--and I certainly understand why this might be true--your only option would be to discard and consolidate. This can be very difficult, since moving one thing in mandates moving something out in order to establish the correct decorum of propinquity with one's possessions.

At this point, prioritization is necessary. You have to ask yourself painful questions, for instance, "is the kitten really necessary?" In the space she's monopolizing, a Miki-Phone or perhaps a Thorens Excelda could easily be accommodated. Along this line, does one really need a chair?

Sorry about all this.... It's what comes from reading James Thurber followed by a healthy dose of Henry James and Edith Wharton....

OF

[epigramophone]

OrthoFan asks "does one really need a chair?" which reminds me of the following true story :

My Micro-Perophone Chromogram pictured on this thread was an eBay purchase which had to be collected. Arriving at the seller's house I was shown into the small front room. In each corner stood a cabinet gramophone, and in the centre of the room was the motor scooter on which the seller commuted to work.

There was no chair.

[bulleid_pacific]

OrthoFan asks "does one really need a chair?" which reminds me of the following true story :

My Micro-Perophone Chromogram pictured on this thread was an eBay purchase which had to be collected. Arriving at the seller's house I was shown into the small front room. In each corner stood a cabinet gramophone, and in the centre of the room was the motor scooter on which the seller commuted to work.

There was no chair.

That is a wonderful story. I can empathise entirely. I fear my wife might not....

[epigramophone]

I have often wondered whether, having sold me the Chromogram, the seller filled the empty corner with a chair or with another gramophone.

[Menophanes]

I can certainly see your point. If moving to larger accommodations is not possible--and I certainly understand why this might be true--your only option would be to discard and consolidate. This can be very difficult, since moving one thing in mandates moving something out in order to establish the correct decorum of propinquity with one's possessions.

At this point, prioritization is necessary. You have to ask yourself painful questions, for instance, "is the kitten really necessary?" In the space she's monopolizing, a Miki-Phone or perhaps a Thorens Excelda could easily be accommodated. Along this line, does one really need a chair?

Sorry about all this.... It's what comes from reading James Thurber followed by a healthy dose of Henry James and Edith Wharton....

OF

In other words, there is a special difficulty in manipulating a Rubik's Cube if you live inside it. But, being myself a connoisseur of formal and dignified language, I appreciate your way of putting it! I wonder if Henry James ever owned any kind of talking-machine or indeed ever heard one? Given the usual repertoire, I cannot see him as a cylinder enthusiast, but some of his society friends might have owned Gramophones.

I need the chair because, by kneeling on the back (fortunately it cannot overturn, being wedged against what I believe to be a pedestal from an early Columbia disc machine, c. 1903), I can just reach my Elgar, Beethoven and Wagner albums which are in the upper section of the wardrobe behind it. Every time I pull one of these out, I run the risk that the sudden increase of weight will throw me into an involuntary back-somersault which would probably break my neck: a mere trifle!

Plato the cat is an ex-tom.

Oliver Mundy.