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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 9:19 am 
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Victor II
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:55 am
Posts: 220
Location: Vienna/Austria
Jwb88 wrote:
Thank you very much for the replies and information so far. So the first incarnation of the 130 was produced 1929-1933? And then I take it there was a 130A produced--for export only or ?

I forgot to include a shot of the badge. If I disregard the 130xxx, the number is 4728. I'm not sure, but that seems low-ish (?) However, I do notice the difference of the tonearm as Teak pointed out. Is it really as late as 1939-194(?) or could mine have been cobbled together later or upgraded from an older model? I think it highly likely that 5 soundboxes get switched around and upgraded a lot, and I just assumed someone had stuck this newer 5B on an older 1929-33 machine. I'm still open minded at the thought of it being produced later though. For export?


The 130A was a normal production model for home and export markets. It is not possible to change the tonearm later on, as the mounting on the horn did change. Upgrading the 5a to a 5b soundbox was not done very often I assume, as it would have been an expensive upgrade for no real measurable improvement, but your 5B model is a later version, as stated. As to your serial number I have no clue :D


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Wed Apr 03, 2019 11:36 pm 
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Victor II
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Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:41 pm
Posts: 330
Location: Riverside, California
Thank you very much for the info, epigramophone! And with respect to the authors, I would absolutely buy their book if I could find it, and one day I will, so hopefully no harm done on sharing the info :lol:

I'm always open minded to the possibility of collectors or dealers piecing machines together or doing odd things within the last 50 years or so. It's hard to tell sometimes. If it required changing the horn on top of it, I don't know. Possible though, maybe? I also notice that mine does not have a metal plate like a lot of them that state "130A."

The tonearm difference I notice is mostly that the brake tab that comes off the arm has a hole/cutout piece in the 130A variation while the other does not. Is that the only difference between the tonearms, or is one larger, etc.? Does anyone know why the arm was changed? I'm just curious.

When I said the 5B seemed like a common upgrade to me, I don't mean I think people upgraded around 1939. I mean that in the last 50 years I think a lot of gramophones originally equipped with 5As had their reproducers crumble and so people took 5Bs off portable 102s for replacement. I know that nice, solid 5A reproducers exist -- it's just that I've never found one, LOL. I personally think they were of worse pot metal than 5Bs--and yet still better pot metal than whatever Victor was using!
"There are two kinds of people in this world: people who eat grapes in the grocery store and good people."


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 5:30 am 
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Victor I
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Joined: Tue Sep 21, 2010 5:52 am
Posts: 192
Location: St. Albans, UK
You've got a nice machine and I think the 130 sounds good and also very loud for its size. I was also a bit confused about the differences in tonearm. The cutout brake bar from the tonearm is common on the 130 even if it does appear on the 130A pictured. The other difference I can see is the position of the tonearm fixing bolts but again it appears that the position as shown on the 130A is also common to the 130. Perhaps 'Teak' is showing an early version of a 130?

The winding handles I have seen on the 130 have always had a bronze finish but nickel may also be correct? The wooden knob is normally painted black and the shape is more rounded or waisted (compared to yours) where it meets the metal post.

I was amazed by the cabinet that you managed to find time to build! The design suits the machine and shows it off really well. Looks very professional. Are you a carpenter? I wish I could build such things.


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:10 am 
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Victor II
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:55 am
Posts: 220
Location: Vienna/Austria
The tonearm is all around different. Diffent diameter, curvature, mounting screws. Also, the 130A horn has the mounting holes rotated, so it is impossible to interchange the tonearm on them.


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Thu Apr 04, 2019 6:43 am 
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Victor II
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Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:41 pm
Posts: 330
Location: Riverside, California
It sounds like, as usual, changes may have been implemented gradually, so who knows. I am always interested in improvements though--any detail that was changed to improve performance or simplify production--so sorry if I get a little boring, I'm just curious.

jamiegramo, thank you for the flattering words about the cabinet I made for it. I was hesitant to feature it in the photos because it's very obviously not old or even a particularly good match to the machine--but I like it! No, I'm not really a carpenter, but I have the benefit of having a garage and a few tools and a knack for making my limited abilities stretch to look a bit more skilled. I made some cube-like shelving a few years ago to hold LPs. I used the same idea here: just simple butt joints, screwed and glued together. The trim hides the screw holes, but also makes for a much better look, a little Art Deco-ish, and at least more elegant than the crate-like plan I first conceived. So far, in the small space I've been using it in, it works extremely well, solid as a rock, and it's actually easy to move/turn. I ordered the wheels from Amazon while putting it together and they work well.

Back to the machine: I checked the tracking error using the handy dandy protractor I printed off of Graham Barber's site. It's not perfect, but it's not bad. I'd say it's about 8 degrees or less away from perfect tracking, on average. I think the 102 tracks slightly better, and my 101 seems to have almost perfect tracking. My interest in tracking error is partly why I was interested in the tonearm change. I was curious to see if it may have been improved with the later design. Perhaps the earlier ones were even further off--or better.
"There are two kinds of people in this world: people who eat grapes in the grocery store and good people."


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 2:51 pm 
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Victor O
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:59 am
Posts: 58
Re Serial numbers; remember that the celluloid label with a serial number starting 130000.... was introduced in 1930, so there would have been many machines made in 1929, with no serial number. So number 4,000 is not as early in the 12,000 run as it might appear!

The difference between a 130 and 130A is indeed the tone-arm bearing, which is smaller in the later version - hence the need for the brake operating arm to be fixed to its circumference rather than on the top of the rim.

In the UK, these metal labels, often with suffix letters after the Model number (and no serial number) were used only in 1929 and, possibly very early 1930, but I have seen them on later machines from the Indian factory. I have never seen a 130 with cabriole legs (though I have seen many 130s on legs -- they're called 145.) The suffix letters continued in use, on service sheets, instructions and the like, but not on the labels on machines, until they re-appeared in 1936 and continued until the end.

The 150 took over from the 130 in November 1933, and ran to 1940, but in India there were some other versions in very modern (or, as we would now call it, 'Art Deco') cases.


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Sat Apr 06, 2019 9:34 pm 
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Victor II
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Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:41 pm
Posts: 330
Location: Riverside, California
Extremely helpful information. Thank you!
"There are two kinds of people in this world: people who eat grapes in the grocery store and good people."


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 12:50 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:28 am
Posts: 3
HI, love the Gramophone, just got a 130 myself (7680) and had a few repairs to do, Sound box, nothing too bad. Did you buy the cabinet your player sits on?


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Mon Aug 12, 2019 9:28 pm 
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Victor II
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Joined: Mon Jul 27, 2015 10:41 pm
Posts: 330
Location: Riverside, California
Hi. No, I actually made the cabinet specifically for this gramophone. It doesn't match very well, since I just used plywood I had on hand, but it's really practical. The wheels make moving it around easy.

I've been in this hobby long enough to realize that I can easily tire of machines. I have not tired of this HMV 130, and I doubt I ever will. The quality, in addition to the practical size, makes it an absolute joy.
"There are two kinds of people in this world: people who eat grapes in the grocery store and good people."


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 Post subject: Re: My New HMV 130
PostPosted: Sun Aug 18, 2019 4:11 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Sun Aug 11, 2019 8:28 am
Posts: 3
Rip1955 wrote:
HI, love the Gramophone, just got a 130 myself (7680) and had a few repairs to do, Sound box, nothing too bad. Did you buy the cabinet your player sits on?


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