Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Monarch?

Discussions on Talking Machines of British or European Manufacture
Post Reply
User avatar
nostalgia
Victor IV
Posts: 1408
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:58 am
Personal Text: Keep winding up
Location: My gramophone repair room

Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Monarch?

Post by nostalgia »

This horn gramophone is for sale, and I find it interesting, and would be grateful if someone can help me identify it.
The soundbox is Thorens, but I guess this one is added at a later date, since this gramophone, if my gut feeling is correct, is an early horn gramophone. I also upload a photo of the trademark logo, found on the gramophone. My gut feeling (again) says this is a genuine gramophone, but I am very prepared to be corrected:)
In advance, thanks a lot.
Update: I googled a bit now, and this trademark seem to belong to The Gramophone Company, before the Nipper dog was introduced. Is this really a HMV Monarch? I feel some trembling inside,,,I need find and open my HMV book! I know this will not be an overlooked thread;) Welcome to exploring and identifying this obvious gem.
A Junior Monarch from around 1905-1907? Welcome, HMV experts, your statements and corrections are very welcome:)
Attachments
1.png
2.JPG
3.JPG
4.png
4.png (258.54 KiB) Viewed 1845 times

Menophanes
Victor II
Posts: 429
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:52 am
Location: Redruth, Cornwall, U.K.

Re: Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Mona

Post by Menophanes »

The back bracket with its large thumbscrews looks right, as does the small three-piece crank. I am a little surprised, though, at the fresh appearance of the nickel-plating and of the 'angel' plaque. I also wonder why we cannot see any brake or even any screw-holes showing where it was. Could this be a partial restoration, interrupted before it reached the turntable or the sound-box?

Oliver Mundy.

epigramophone
Victor Monarch Special
Posts: 5227
Joined: Mon Oct 24, 2011 1:21 pm
Personal Text: An analogue relic trapped in a digital world.
Location: The Somerset Levels, UK.

Re: Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Mona

Post by epigramophone »

When you find your copy of "His Master's Gramophone" the Monarch Junior is pictured on Page 26.
The position of the turntable brake is clearly shown and, unless the case has been refinished, the gilt G&T transfer should be present.

User avatar
nostalgia
Victor IV
Posts: 1408
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:58 am
Personal Text: Keep winding up
Location: My gramophone repair room

Re: Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Mona

Post by nostalgia »

Epigramohone: Yes, I found the book, and the Junior Monarch on page 26. But as Oliver says,. what happened with the brake? Totally camouflaged the screw holes too? And yes, the gilt transfer, it should have been visible on one of the pictured sides of the case. So the statement is, refinished?
Last edited by nostalgia on Thu Sep 19, 2019 11:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

Teak
Victor II
Posts: 261
Joined: Fri Jul 28, 2017 6:55 am
Location: Vienna/Austria

Re: Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Mona

Post by Teak »

This looks like an early german version. Parts of the early break are visible in the first picture.
Attachments
Bildschirmfoto 2019-09-19 um 16.56.54.png
Bildschirmfoto 2019-09-19 um 16.56.54.png (243.52 KiB) Viewed 1804 times

soundgen
Victor VI
Posts: 3001
Joined: Mon May 13, 2013 2:04 pm
Contact:

Re: Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Mona

Post by soundgen »

How much is it ? If it is like your other buys it will be a bargain is is a basically sound machine 1

User avatar
nostalgia
Victor IV
Posts: 1408
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:58 am
Personal Text: Keep winding up
Location: My gramophone repair room

Re: Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Mona

Post by nostalgia »

I appreciate much your comments, and also that some of you that have worked with gramophones for decades voice your opinions, and state that despite its pitfalls it can be a good buy if the price is reasonable. The selling price is not yet totally established, and there are also a few more potential buyers. But, as it looks now it may be in the 200-300 euro range, which I presume would be quite a bargain, since this is a very old HMV horn model, even if it shows obvious signs of being refinished?

User avatar
nostalgia
Victor IV
Posts: 1408
Joined: Thu Jun 13, 2019 1:58 am
Personal Text: Keep winding up
Location: My gramophone repair room

Re: Help with identification of horn gramophone.. a HMV Mona

Post by nostalgia »

Update: The gramophone would have cost me 550 Euro if I bought it, included shipping and taxes, so I dropped it. My budget would not have allowed this purchase, and also I am not sure if I would have been ready to pay this price for this Junior Monarch, taking into consideration it's obvious faults. I am also not in the position to appraise a gramophone of this age yet.

Post Reply