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 Post subject: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Sun Mar 10, 2019 2:12 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2017 7:45 pm
Posts: 43
Phonographs, horns, parts, books, literature up for auction March 16 & 17 in Union, Illinois.

Don't miss the opportunity to own of these great machines from this huge collection.

Go to DonleyAuctions.com and click on the red button to view entire catalog.

Check out some of the highlights below....


Attachments:
File comment: Victor Victrola XVI Vernis Martin Phonograph
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369.jpg [ 146.01 KiB | Viewed 1198 times ]
File comment: Victor VI Phonograph w/Wood Horn
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348.jpg [ 143.33 KiB | Viewed 1198 times ]
File comment: Victor Eldridge R Johnson Trademark B Phonograph
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314.jpg [ 181.16 KiB | Viewed 1198 times ]
File comment: Berliner Type JS Gramophone of 1899
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313.jpg [ 169.87 KiB | Viewed 1198 times ]
File comment: Edison Opera Cylinder Phonograph
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173.jpg [ 185.33 KiB | Viewed 1198 times ]
File comment: Columbia Coin Operated Cylinder Phonograph
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69.jpg [ 202.63 KiB | Viewed 1198 times ]
File comment: Columbia Graphophone Grand GG Cylinder Phonograph
42.jpg
42.jpg [ 93.44 KiB | Viewed 1198 times ]
File comment: Duplex Phonograph Co. Kalamazoo Michigan
5.jpg
5.jpg [ 162.6 KiB | Viewed 1198 times ]


Last edited by DonleyAuctions on Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:18 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:02 am 
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Victor II
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Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:58 am
Posts: 300
Such a shame that horns and reproducers were separated from machines. It seems like historical integrity is being sacrificed.

The electric type N should be sold with it’s original gutta percha set and 15” flared cone horn, but those are being sold separately. How do I know they were together? I saw this stuff in person while it was still on site.


Attachments:
68B3A17D-5161-4EB3-A920-3F44AA5B0CF5.jpeg
68B3A17D-5161-4EB3-A920-3F44AA5B0CF5.jpeg [ 721.73 KiB | Viewed 917 times ]


Last edited by long_island_phono on Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:42 am, edited 1 time in total.
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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 2:02 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2017 7:45 pm
Posts: 43
Thank you for your comments. However, the horn and reproducer is the set that came with the machine. Do we know if this was original to the machine? No. No one will ever know for sure. Whoever wants to keep the parts with the machine, can buy them separately at the auction. Lot #43 is the machine, Lot #46 is the Gutta Percha set. The horn will be added this week.

Thank you again and good luck bidding!


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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 6:55 pm 
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Victor II
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Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:58 am
Posts: 300
DonleyAuctions wrote:
However, the horn and reproducer is the set that came with the machine.... The horn will be added this week.


So...you included the #2 reproducer yet not the horn?

DonleyAuctions wrote:
Whoever wants to keep the parts with the machine, can buy them separately at the auction.


I distinctly recall asking Ken if that N had a gutta percha set, to which he replied by showing me the set which was hidden a few feet away. As you should well know, many things in that house are complete, yet moved around. The gutta percha set, horn, and N are easily indentifiably as being related.

With your logic you ought to have separated the cabinet from the mech, and even separated the topworks from motor. After all someone could buy each individual part to make a complete electric N! Maybe someone would want just the electric motor! I’m kidding of course. Those things aren’t logical but separating arguably original reproducers and horns only makes sense if your only goal is making a buck, not preservation. It’s apparent what is going on, and fluffy language cannot hide it. I was hoping there would be a correction made but oh well.


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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:18 pm 
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Victor IV
I've got both kinds of music--classical & rag-time.
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:39 am
Posts: 1033
Location: South Carolina
Agreeing with you.

What if someone on the floor wins the machine but an online buyer is going for the horn? Then the floor buyer is either going to have to pay through the nose for the machine, or have to hunt for some unobtanium part which had been with his phonograph for 110 years until recently, or end up not enjoying his phonograph as much because he couldn't get the whole thing original...

I'm sorry--Donley Auctions has always been pretty neat & I respect what you do for the hobby, but you guys have stepped in it rather badly with this one.

In all my collection only one horn machine still has its original horn--a clapped-out BN Graphophone. I'm fully restoring it. It's getting the VIP treatment because that horn has been with it since 1909. I could easily swap, upgrade to a wood horn, or whatever...but while it would be "era appropriate" it wouldn't be right for THAT machine.

Pretty bad when the No. 1 auction company starts treating history like this...we treat phonographs as collectibles but it may be time to re-consider them as artifacts.


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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 10:54 pm 
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Victor V
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:55 am
Posts: 2167
Location: Eugene/ Springfield Oregon USA
Agree as well- it's too bad to see Donley become just another eBay dismantler but it's their business...


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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Mon Mar 11, 2019 11:11 pm 
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Victor IV
I've got both kinds of music--classical & rag-time.
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:39 am
Posts: 1033
Location: South Carolina
Their business, and the future not only of our hobby but of those to come.

Now whose business is it?


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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2019 12:54 am 
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Victor II
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Joined: Fri Jan 04, 2013 2:58 am
Posts: 300
VanEpsFan1914 wrote:
Their business, and the future not only of our hobby but of those to come.

Now whose business is it?


Exactly. A collector, one hopes, is someone who is preserving something for future study. That is why I tout myself, with justification, as a preservationist. Those selling to collectors, especially long time sellers in a particular market, should have a sensitivity when it comes to the goods they are selling, one would expect?

It’s easy to get philosophical when you talk about business. Capitaism is great when there is a moral component, the problem is there usually isn’t and if there is, then there is trouble agreeing which morals to follow. Sometimes the answer is pretty clear and I think in this case it is.


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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2019 1:17 am 
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Victor V
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:55 am
Posts: 2167
Location: Eugene/ Springfield Oregon USA
I wasn't being flip about it when I said "it's their business"... I was just stating fact.


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 Post subject: Re: AUCTION March 16 & 17 - Don't miss it!
PostPosted: Tue Mar 12, 2019 5:44 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2017 7:45 pm
Posts: 43
So everyone can calm down, let's get the facts straight. First off, when a client consigns his collection to me they generally want the most money that they can get for it. They will ask me for recommendations but their word is final, it is their collection, not mine. And I also respect the history of a machine as much as any other collector. As you know, we've been in the business almost 50 years. The Columbia N electric was consigned with the horn and with the 2 gutta percha repro/rec set in the original wood box. During the process of lotting the machine it was discussed as to how to sell it. Two different top Columbia collectors were asked the question, "If it was yours, what would you do?" Without hesitation they both replied that, "they would separate them". But it is always left up to the client to make the decision. Mr. Stokes said to separate them. And it was only after getting Mr. Stokes permission today, because of the forum questions as to why it was done, that I can tell you his reasoning. Mr. Stokes said that the 3 pieces did NOT come together. He says that the machine itself was acquired from a Texas radio collector years ago, and the horn and gutta percha set were also acquired separately and HE put them together. Any other information about this machine is incorrect.

We do appreciate everyone's concern and hope that this clears up any controversy regarding this machine.

We look forward to having a great auction for Mr. Stokes this weekend and wish you all success with your bids.


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