C250/C19 Database project

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fran604g
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by fran604g »

colmike1 wrote:I have a C19 currently on eBay. Here are the details:
1. Model Designation: C-19

2. Serial Number: 79726

3. Bedplate Pinstriping: N

4. "Official Laboratory" Medallion: Round

5. Exact Wording of the Medallion: Diamond Disc Official Laboratory Model Thos A Edison

6. Record Storage: Shelves

7. Cabinet Wood Type: Mahogany

8. Duncan Stop?: N

9. Dealer Tag: N

10. Original Dated Sales Receipt/Shipping Documentation, etc.: N

11. Grille cloth? Color?: Traces, appear to have been gold

For those with C-19's, please supplement the above information to include the following addendums to the list of criteria that I've asked for previously:

12) Is the reproducer, horn throat, and other hardware on the turntable: gold plated

13) Is the record storage door held open by a rod: at the center shelf

14) Are the numbered strips for the record storage: 1-36 on both strips

15) Does the governor: 2 springs
Thank you, sir! I've added your observations to the spreadsheet.

Happy Holidays!

Fran
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"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while" - the unappreciative supervisor.

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fran604g
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by fran604g »

Lucius1958 wrote:Addition:

4(A): Yes (governor & spring barrel): black.

Bill
Thank you, Bill. FYI: You've provided me with this information at some point earlier, but I appreciate your fortitude. :)

Happy Holidays!

Fran
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"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while" - the unappreciative supervisor.

sam1979
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by sam1979 »

Thank you very much for the information of your long-traveled ca.1916 Chippendale C 250! Long may she sing!

Happy Holidays!

Fran
Thanks!

Enjoy the holidays too. This is a great project and seems to have yielded some really good responses - should prove an interesting, albeit time-consuming piece of work. Glad somebody's taken it on.

Cheers,

Sam.

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fran604g
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by fran604g »

sam1979 wrote:
Thank you very much for the information of your long-traveled ca.1916 Chippendale C 250! Long may she sing!

Happy Holidays!

Fran
Thanks!

Enjoy the holidays too. This is a great project and seems to have yielded some really good responses - should prove an interesting, albeit time-consuming piece of work. Glad somebody's taken it on.

Cheers,

Sam.
Thank you for the kind words, Sam. It has been my pleasure compiling information about Edison's Chippendale Phonograph.

I wrote a 4-part series of articles titled "The Edison Chippendale C 250 and its Successor: the C 19"; featured in the APS journal The Antique Phonograph from December 2015 through September 2016, in celebration of the Chippendale's 100th anniversary. I also compiled a "production date estimates" spreadsheet, that can be accessed by the general public at the Antique Phonograph Society webpage, here: https://www.antiquephono.org/category/introductory/

Although my work has been put to print, I will continue to add to my spreadsheet, for posterity. This post is also a great way for the novice collector to learn much about their "new" Chippendale, and it's my hope that my work will "stand the test of time" in perpetuity!

If you're not already a member of the APS, I would encourage you to join -- the dues are miniscule compared to the wealth of knowledge one is able to access as a member. As a member of the Society, my articles can be accessed via the search function at the website.

Happy Holidays!

Fran.
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"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while" - the unappreciative supervisor.

sam1979
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by sam1979 »

Thanks very much for pointing me to the link(s) - a fascinating insight into the variations over the production run and invaluable to those of us interested in dating our machines, or otherwise interested in their histories. I will join the APS, keep meaning to but I will get round to it this holiday period. There's so much to be gained! I really do admire the effort that people put into things like this, I am involved with other preservation type hobbies (Commercial road steam, vintage maritime, theatre organs and (although I can't collect them..) preservation based upkeep of historic buildings is a large part of my job. It always astounds me how much time and effort people are prepared to put into the detail, aand documentation of the bits of history that are so easily lost in time.
Remarkably useful to a lot of us, it's researches like this that are invaluable to anyone who is aiming to maintain a degree of originality, so thanks again.

Sam.

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DGPros
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by DGPros »

1. Model Designation: C-250

2. Serial Number: 60360

3. Bedplate Pinstriping: N

4. "Official Laboratory" Medallion: Round

5. Exact Wording of the Medallion: The model 250 diamond disc phonograph is the official laboratory model

6. Record Storage: Drawers

7. Cabinet Wood Type: Mahogany

8. Duncan Stop?: Y

9. Dealer Tag: N Cabinet manufacturer was 19 A record duster was in the cabinet.(Blake & Burkart "The Home of the New Edison" Eleventh & Walnut Philadelphia)See picture

10. Original Dated Sales Receipt/Shipping Documentation, etc.: N

11. Grille cloth? Color?: No

Unfortunately this cabinet must have been sitting in water and is now a donor machine.
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billybob62
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by billybob62 »

fran604g wrote:Hi folks,

It is my intention to compile as much data as I can find to establish, exactly or as closely as I can, when significant production changes were made to the C250 and C19 Diamond Disc Phonographs over their lifetimes. Once compiled, I feel that I should be able to demonstrate a chronological history of these changes and, hopefully, identify precisely when these changes were implemented by Thomas A. Edison Inc., from a serialization standpoint and when.

This is a large undertaking and, admittedly, I am a bit daunted, but I shall do my best.

The following are particular features and characteristics that I am looking for:

1. Model Designation: (C-250 or C-19)

2. Serial Number:

3. Bedplate Pinstriping: Y/N

4. "Official Laboratory" Medallion: Round/Pentagonal/None

5. Exact Wording of the Medallion: Please be precise (Abbreviated signature, for example)

6. Record Storage: Drawers or Shelves?

7. Cabinet Wood Type: Mahogany or Oak?

8. Duncan Stop?: Y/N

9. Dealer Tag: Name/Address, Location On Machine

10. Original Dated Sales Receipt/Shipping Documentation, etc.: (Dates are particularly noteworthy):

11. Grille cloth? Color?

For those with C-19's, please supplement the above information to include the following addendums to the list of criteria that I've asked for previously:

12) Is the reproducer, horn throat, and other hardware on the turntable gold plated or gun-metal?

13) Is the record storage door held open by a rod at the top, center shelf or the bottom of the cabinet?

14) Are the numbered strips for the record storage 1-36 on both strips or 1-36 on the top strip and 37-72 on the bottom strip?

15) Does the governor have 2 springs or 3 springs?

If you would rather remain anonymous, please feel free to PM me here, or you can email me at FPratt1426 (at) gmail (dot) com, instead of posting a reply.

Your participation and comments are truly appreciated, thank you,

Fran
1) C-250

2) SX 6056

3) 3A

4) N/A

5) P2

6) 6A

7) Oak

8) No

9) From 229 So Wabash Avenue (I assume Chicago. No Dealer Name Shown).

10) N/A

11) Yes/Red

12) Gold

13) Rod At the Bottom

14) No

15) Not Sure

Cheers,
John
Last edited by billybob62 on Tue Mar 20, 2018 4:56 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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fran604g
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by fran604g »

DGPros wrote:1. Model Designation: C-250

2. Serial Number: 60360

3. Bedplate Pinstriping: N

4. "Official Laboratory" Medallion: Round

5. Exact Wording of the Medallion: The model 250 diamond disc phonograph is the official laboratory model

6. Record Storage: Drawers

7. Cabinet Wood Type: Mahogany

8. Duncan Stop?: Y

9. Dealer Tag: N Cabinet manufacturer was 19 A record duster was in the cabinet.(Blake & Burkart "The Home of the New Edison" Eleventh & Walnut Philadelphia)See picture

10. Original Dated Sales Receipt/Shipping Documentation, etc.: N

11. Grille cloth? Color?: No

Unfortunately this cabinet must have been sitting in water and is now a donor machine.
Thank you, Gary! I've added your Chippendale.

Cheers,
Fran
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"Even a blind squirrel finds a nut once in a while" - the unappreciative supervisor.

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fran604g
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by fran604g »

billybob62 wrote:2) SX 6056
Cheers, John
Hi John, thanks for participating.
Could you elaborate a bit more on number 2? I've never seen a serial number to have had the prefix "SX",

Thank you,
Fran
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fran604g
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Re: C250/C19 Database project

Post by fran604g »


For any future participants, I was compelled to update my questionnaire more than once throughout the history of my post.

Thank you all, for your participation,
Fran


This is the "current" version:
fran604g wrote:Hi folks,

I will continue to update my spreadsheet to reflect new entries, so I am posting this updated version of the questionnaire for newer members, or veterans that may not have participated in the project.

For further accuracy, I've found it necessary to develop additional sub-categories for many of the original categories over the course of my study, and they are reflected in this UPDATED post.

Your participation and comments are truly appreciated.

Thank you all,
Fran


The following are particular features that I am observing, please number your responses accordingly.

1. What is the Model Designation? "C 250" or "C 19"

2. What is the Serial Number? "SM-??????"

3. Which finish does the motor plate have?:

3A) "Maroon" with gold pin striping (as the B 250 had).
3B) "Black with Maroon decals" (the maroon decals are applied near the speed control knob, and at the lower left hand corner of the motor plate".
3C) "Black ONLY with pin striping present".
3D) "Black with NO pin striping".

4(A) Are there drip pans present under the governor, innermost spring barrel (found only on the earliest C 250's) AND: are they finished in "Maroon", or "Black”?

4(B) Does the top of the motor plate have a continuous flat surface, or is there a large concentric circular depression (located beneath the turntable) present? Please state "Flat" or "Circular".

4(C) Does the governor (located beneath the turntable) have "2 springs" or "3 springs"?

4(D) Which finish is on the reproducer, horn throat, and other hardware on the motor plate? “Gold plated”, or “Gun-metal” (AKA "antique bronze")?

5. Which "Official Laboratory Medallion" is present?

5A) "P-1" = Pentagonal flange with circular boss stating: “The $250 Diamond Disc Phonograph is the Official Laboratory Model Thos A Edison”
5B) "P-2" = Pentagonal flange with circular boss stating: “The C250 Diamond Disc Phonograph is the Official Laboratory Model Thos A Edison”
5C) "R-1" = Round emblem stating: “The Model 250 Diamond Disc Phonograph is the Official Laboratory Model Thos A Edison”
5D) "R-2" = Round emblem stating: “Diamond Disc Official Laboratory Model Thos A Edison”

6. Which form of record storage is present:

6A) 2 Drawers divided into 5-compartments.
6B) 2 Drawers divided by individual record "slots", each numbered 1-36.
6C) 2 Shelves divided by individual record "slots"; AND: Are the corresponding numbered strips for the shelves: 1-36 on both strips OR are they numbered 1-36 on the top strip and 37-72 on the bottom strip?

7. Cabinet Wood Type: "Mahogany" or "Oak"

8. Is an "Electric Automatic Stop" (AKA Duncan Stop) present on the motor plate? Yes/No

9. Please list any dealer tags or decals present anywhere on the cabinet: Name/Address, location on machine, etc.

10. Are there any original dated sales receipts/shipping documentation, etc. with the machine? (Dates are particularly noteworthy)

11. Is there Grille cloth present? AND: What is the Color?

12. Is the record storage door held open by a rod at the top, center, or the bottom of the cabinet door?

13. What is the "Cabinet Factory No." - (if present) as found on the sticker inside the horn compartment
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