The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

It is currently Mon Feb 18, 2019 3:55 am

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 58 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 7:27 pm 
Offline
Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 763
Got this machine today. Has problems. Not sure I did the right thing to buy it, but I did. I've uploaded some pictures. The major problem is that it took a tumble sometime in the past. It must have landed on the bracket and split the backboard in more than one place. You can see how it was repaired. The motor has an open barrel. Is that right? Also the weights on the governor are different from what I expected. I looked at a Vic I and it had the more familiar hemispheres. I have a spare set of three that I could retrofit to this machine. The horn seems intact, but its been painted red. If people want to ask me what I paid, that's OK. Lots of pictures follow. Restoreable or parts?


Attachments:
vic 0 013.JPG
vic 0 013.JPG [ 163.68 KiB | Viewed 3239 times ]
vic 0 010.JPG
vic 0 010.JPG [ 161.97 KiB | Viewed 3239 times ]
vic 0 008.JPG
vic 0 008.JPG [ 162.04 KiB | Viewed 3239 times ]
vic 0 005.JPG
vic 0 005.JPG [ 169.98 KiB | Viewed 3239 times ]
vic 0 002.JPG
vic 0 002.JPG [ 164.02 KiB | Viewed 3239 times ]
vic 0 001.JPG
vic 0 001.JPG [ 160.32 KiB | Viewed 3239 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 8:05 pm 
Offline
Victor IV
User avatar
Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:22 pm
Posts: 1103
I'm pretty sure I know what you paid for this machine as I called on it within 3 hours of the owner's first posting of it around 3 weeks ago. The machine was located in Pennsylvania. He was asking only $225 for it at that time and I called him about it. After I determined that the backmount and elbow were original and in fine condition I knew it was well worth the money he was asking for it in spite of the damage he described to the rear cabinet panel and the repainted horn. I also asked him if the reproducer indicated Exhibition Jr or simply Exhibition and he informed me that it indicated only Exhibition. I asked if we could meet somewhere between PA and where I live as I had the cash waiting for it. I was simply not willing to drive 5 hours for it in its condition and he was not willing to drive 2 hours or so to meet me and that was that. You got a good deal on it. If I lived closer it would have been here 3 weeks ago. I have a near perfect original Victor O horn waiting for the right machine. It's well worth fixing. I can't believe that it took him 3 weeks to sell it as the price was very reasonable. There are a LOT of nice machines that seem to turn up in PA. Lucky collectors that live there!

Doug


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 8:28 pm 
Offline
Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 763
You are right about the origin of the piece. We met at a halfway point about 1-1/2 hours away from home; otherwise he was 3 or 4 hours away. I too balked at the distance. But then I had business in York, and he was coming down to Carlisle anyway, so I managed to kill two birds with one stone. I had the day off from work anyway, so I thought what the heck. He is a nice fellow interested in car restoration, hence the trip to Carlisle. We talked about price, dickered a bit, and I got it for $165. I'm not so sure it was a good buy yet until I take the motor apart. I've searched the web for pictures of Vic 0 motors; so far no luck. I did see a Vic I, but the governor's weights were different.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 9:18 pm 
Offline
Victor Monarch Special
User avatar
Who is John Galt?
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 6:08 pm
Posts: 5707
Location: New York's Finger Lakes
You may want to check this article on the Antique Phonograph Society website:

http://www.antiquephono.org/victorvictr ... ld-braker/

Photo 5 and Photo 6 show two motors used in the 0, and there's a description of both motors directly above the illustrations. Looks like they both used hemispheric governor weights.

George P.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Thu Oct 02, 2014 11:19 pm 
Offline
Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 763
George: Thanks for that article! I now know what I will be reading over the weekend. I can see already that I have the type shown in photo 5(E). So now I've seen about three photos of motors and they all have the familiar hemispheres. I have a set of those off a scrap motor. I may need to buy the springs, that is, if they are the same as used in later models.

People may think this is a great buy, but I'm the one looking at it and I'm not so sure. It has issues, and they are not confined just to the case, but to the motor, and the horn, and possibly the bracket. This Vic 0 has had a hard life. I will first disassemble and clean the motor. Right now the ratchet wheel slips or the pawl or both. And the crank is not original.

I'll post some pictures as I go. Perhaps they may be useful to others for close-ups of an early victor motor. I can see that the worms on both the spindle and governor are coarser than later models.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 6:23 am 
Offline
Victor IV
User avatar
A new blank with authentic formula and spiral core!
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 10:50 am
Posts: 1402
Location: 615 1/2 South Main Street Princeton IL 61356.
Looks like someone replaced the back bracket screws too. I have a Victor, O and it has the Exhibition JR reproducer, it is a cast body, no rubber isolation gasket, the connector is part of the reproducer, and gaskets were installed after a spring clip is removed. Yours looks fairly early from the exposed spring, probably 1909-1911. I think you got a good deal. My little O in volume and tone outdoes my Victrola XIV by leaps and bounds, not sure why but for sound quality for a little machine, it is surprising. I am still in need of a horn for mine. Congrats on the fact yours has a horn, the horn costs almost as much as the machine. The motor plays one record, This is a video before I did some tweeking.

http://youtu.be/fJzxXcUlQck


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 8:05 am 
Offline
Victor III
User avatar
F. Depero, "Grammofono", 1923.
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 4:19 am
Posts: 749
Location: Italy
jboger wrote:
People may think this is a great buy, but I'm the one looking at it and I'm not so sure.

I see your point, but in turn I also think it was a good deal. You have more value in spare parts than what you paid for the entire machine. However, my vote definitely goes for restoring this little cute gramophone. It really deserves some loving care after its troubled life. You can easily fix the case much better than how it is now without too much work. The motor spring doesn't even need to be disassembled in order to lubricate it. Exhibition soundboxes are among the easiest to rebuild and replacement parts are cheap as well as easily available. The remaining components can be re-nickeled.

Concerning the governor, I suppose that the whole springs + wheights assembly was replaced. One (or more) springs probably break during "the big fall", they're more thin and fragile than most people think. Judging by your first picture, it seems that a snippet of the old spring has been reused as a washer under a screw. Usually springs were tightened with standard circular washers.

edisonphonoworks wrote:
Looks like someone replaced the back bracket screws too.

Yes, definitely. But that's pretty obvious if you take a look at the inside of the case. The original threaded plate is missing and the arm support is directly fastened to the "L" brackets.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Fri Oct 03, 2014 9:50 am 
Offline
VTLA
User avatar
TMF Moderator
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:36 am
Posts: 2473
Location: Delaware
jboger wrote:
People may think this is a great buy, but I'm the one looking at it and I'm not so sure.


I it is a great buy, congratulations. I agree that it requires some work, but isn't that the fun part of this hobby? Please don't use it for parts, it is definitely fixable. For what it cost I would take it in a heartbeat off your hands, as other members would probably as well.

Good luck and please continue to share pictures and experience. Remember, help is only a forum post away.
Thanks
Andreas


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2014 8:49 am 
Offline
Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 763
Some more pictures. I started to take the motor apart and just now took some jpegs. You can see that the spindle and governor threads on the earlier Vic O motor are more coarse than later models. I've included a governor from a later model, which seems interchangeable with a great many later model Victor motors. I will take the weights off that governor and see if they work on the Vic O. In another photo you can see that the ratchet wheel teeth are askew. This is why the pawl is slipping. Having trouble disassembling the mainspring barrel. At one end of the barrel arbor, the end with the ratchet wheel, has a nut that holds everything together. This nut must be removed to take apart the mainspring and gears. It is held in place by a hole that goes through the nut and through the mainspring arbor, through which a pin is driven. Won't budge.


Attachments:
vic 0 003.JPG
vic 0 003.JPG [ 159.98 KiB | Viewed 2984 times ]
vic 0 005.JPG
vic 0 005.JPG [ 159.8 KiB | Viewed 2984 times ]
vic 0 001.JPG
vic 0 001.JPG [ 159.79 KiB | Viewed 2984 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sat Oct 04, 2014 3:38 pm 
Offline
Victor V
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:08 pm
Posts: 2053
Location: Harrison Township, MI
The governor you got with the machine is correct, but as you noticed, the weights are not. The other governor you show does not have the correct weights either. The correct ones are semi spherical, similar to those on the other governor you have, but are made of lead and sort of "saddle" over the governor spring. All that being said, it appears that the incorrect weights should work just fine.


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 58 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Bing [Bot] and 16 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Americanized by Maël Soucaze.