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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 9:18 pm 
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Victor I
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Joined: Fri Oct 02, 2009 4:36 pm
Posts: 108
Location: Fort Worth
Loving this thread can't wait to see final results. I have the same observation that it's hard to find standard head screws. Have had luck at Ace Hardware of all places but they are hidden in trays there. Also perhaps Woodcraft wood working store has tradition hardware as well as shellac and other finishes to the liking of our hobby. Like the idea of torching them to age new ones. Wonder if fumming will do same with ammonia? That certainly darkens wood quickly.


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sat Dec 06, 2014 9:44 pm 
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VTLA
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Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:36 am
Posts: 2473
Location: Delaware
I purchased screws before at Blacksmithbolts, because they also offer nickel plated wood screws. Unfortunately shipping is quite expensive, so I pretty much order a bunch of every size I thought I will probably need.

Naval Jelly also works quite well to remove the zinc plating on new screws.

Andreas


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 2:50 am 
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Victor VI
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 7:00 pm
Posts: 3513
Location: Western, WA State
What I have done to blacken/blue a screw is clean them real good with rubbing alcohol. Then I use Birchwood Casey Gun Blue. You can apply this as much as you want to get the desired finish. You can get this product at any good gun store.This will work on those zinc plated screws. This works great on screws that need to be blued. It only takes a few minutes to do this task. This is a good tip for those Edison screws. Your machine is looking good.
Harvey Kravitz


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 2:55 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 763
Final results will have to wait awhile. For instance, I will either have to refinish the entire case or match the new backboard to the rest of the case. Have never done the latter. Now wrt to the horn, I don't want to call it progress, but I tried several solvents on the horn to see what would happen. Acetone takes it off. It also evaporates very quickly.
But if I keep enough acetone in contact with the red paint long enough, then my Q-tip or cloth picks up the red paint. I can even see the original cream-colored paint underneath in a few tiny spots where I removed the red. I don't think I can control the process well enough and will eventually just remove the original paint as well. I suspect the original paint may not be in that great a state. I don't think the effort is really worth it, but I am curious to see if I can do it. I'm not in a hurry.

Back to screws. I'm committed to getting screws that match Larry's as closely as possible. It looks like that one internet store has them. Yeah, shipping is expensive for a small order. If I were to order just two screws, they would cost me about 25 cents; shipping would be another $11.25. Or in other words, about $5.60 a screw. Just can't bring myself to do that just yet.


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 3:17 pm 
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Victor VI
Joined: Mon Nov 16, 2009 10:42 am
Posts: 3553
Location: Western Canada
Phonofreak wrote:
What I have done to blacken/blue a screw is clean them real good with rubbing alcohol. Then I use Birchwood Casey Gun Blue. You can apply this as much as you want to get the desired finish. You can get this product at any good gun store.This will work on those zinc plated screws. This works great on screws that need to be blued. It only takes a few minutes to do this task. This is a good tip for those Edison screws. Your machine is looking good.
Harvey Kravitz


Another little trick to get your screws black, is to heat the screw red hot and then drop into a can of used "black" motor oil. This will produce a "oil" finish you may have read about. The key is, to make sure the oil is well used and black.


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sun Dec 07, 2014 4:14 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Wed Feb 11, 2009 2:30 pm
Posts: 837
jboger wrote:
I will either have to refinish the entire case or match the new backboard to the rest of the case. Have never done the latter.


I'd encourage you to try to match the backboard to the case. Especially since you've never done that before. If you fail, you can always strip it off and try again. If you succeed you'll have preserved the original finish on ¾ of your machine (actually all of it if you keep the original broken back ;) ). I had one Edison machine that had a destroyed back panel that needed refinishing, but the rest was so nice, I didn't want to re-do that. It took me a while to build up the color to match, but it came out nice.

jboger wrote:
If I were to order just two screws, they would cost me about 25 cents; shipping would be another $11.25. Or in other words, about $5.60 a screw. Just can't bring myself to do that just yet.


Try looking at it this way: If you were buying original screws from a parts dealer, how much do you think he or she would charge you? I'd look at this as an opportunity to build up a supply of useful sizes/types. They have a couple of assortment sets. Anyway, good luck on the hunt.

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Sun Dec 21, 2014 4:18 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 763
Work continues on this machine.

I now have bracket screws (I will reveal my source later) that come from a Victor IV. They look absolutely perfect. Do have two questions before I install the back bracket. The first one: If you look on the second or third page of this thread you will see a side shot of the Vic O. You can see the "escutcheon." Is there any possibility that this is the original escutcheon? I don't think so. It's not screwed on, and I believe I see at least one of the original screw holes for the original escutcheon. Not sure about that. Whatever it is, it is also internally threaded, which makes no sense whatsoever. But before I take it off, I would like to hear what others might say. I have the proper escutcheon for this early machine and intend to use it (again I will reveal my source later once everything is installed), but want to make sure I don't have some sort of custom factory job for the escutcheon--that doesn't make any sense either. It's the right diameter for the crank, which is what makes me wonder . . .

My second question concerns the bracket screws. For those who have an original Vic O, do the bracket screws pierce all the way through the wood and come out the opposite side? I've attached the bracket to the original backboard using these "new" screws, and it looks as if they either just break through or fall a hair short. It's hard to tell because the break in the wood goes right through the screw holes and splintered the wood. I know this sounds awful fussy, but if someone knows or can check against their own Vic O, that would be greatly appreciated. If it's too much trouble, I fully, fully understand. I can also shorten the two screws as well. But if they did break through, well, so will mine. The devil's in the details.


With the answers to these questions--thanks to everyone in advance--I will be ready to mount the bracket and put that escutcheon on.

John


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 1:42 am 
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Victor II
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Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 5:23 pm
Posts: 496
Location: Michigan
Your Victor O would have had an escutcheon like this. If you remove what you have you should see two screw holes from the original escutcheon.
Attachment:
P1090736.jpg
P1090736.jpg [ 141.2 KiB | Viewed 740 times ]


The screws on my back bracket go completely through the case back.
Attachment:
P1090734.jpg
P1090734.jpg [ 199.49 KiB | Viewed 740 times ]


I'm looking forward to seeing the completed project, your doing a great job.
Best Regards, Larry


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 9:08 am 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 763
Larry: I can not thank you enough for your help and the trouble you've taken to show me how the Vic O was put together. I can proceed now with the back bracket and the escutcheon. I will do that after Christmas sometime. I am on what's called annual leave from my job and I want to take the time to carefully align the back bracket so it is on true. I will use the original backboard as a guide. So when wife is at work and last remaining kid is in school, and all is quiet, I will complete this task. I will post photos at that time.


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 Post subject: Re: New acquisition -- Vic 0
PostPosted: Mon Dec 22, 2014 5:13 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 763
I had planned to put the back bracket on after Christmas sometime, but today I had the house to myself. So fire when ready, Gridley. Many thanks go to Larry and his photographs, and to Bill (rizbone) for supplying the bracket screws. They do indeed pierce the backboard. Three photos follow. It might not seem much of a change from when I first got the decrepit machine, but the badly and multiply fractured backboard has been replaced, the motor has been cleaned and now winds and runs (noisily) with the new ratchet wheel supplied by George Vollema, and the bracket is now attached properly (no inside angle braces) with the correct period screws.The horn right now is held on by duct tape. And the "escutcheon" in there now is solidly in there; I will need to study the problem before removing it.

Far from done, but moving along.

John


Attachments:
back bracket on 001.JPG
back bracket on 001.JPG [ 159.96 KiB | Viewed 706 times ]
back bracket on 003.JPG
back bracket on 003.JPG [ 158.27 KiB | Viewed 706 times ]
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