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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2017 7:25 pm 
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Victor III
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Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:22 pm
Posts: 919
jboger wrote:
Doug: I've attached a photo of the motor. This is clearly a Columbia motor. I see no signs of any swapping of motors, and the crank shaft lines up clearly and properly with the crank escutcheon.


Thanks for the motor pictures. :)

Please understand that I didn't presume that your motor was swapped for a different motor.

The reason that I wanted to see a picture of the motor in your Standard Model A was to confirm my suspicion that it was a transitional Standard Model A. That is, having a slightly taller cabinet than the common earlier Standard Model A but having the vertically positioned mainspring barrel and, of course, the top mounted start/stop/speed lever.

The transitional Standard Model A is definitely more scarce than the commonly found Standard Model A with start/stop/speed control plunger shaft protruding from the cabinet front.

The very last (and rarest) version of the Standard Model A had an interesting horizontally positioned main spring barrel and a noticeably larger cabinet than prior models. I've only seen a couple of these in more than thirty years.

The motor on this last version of the Standard Model A also had a very interesting motor flaw: the factory installed rivet protruding from the mainspring barrel (to secure one end of the mainspring) tended to hang up on one of two motor pillars as the mainspring revolved - thus halting the running motor or at the very least slowing the motor considerably as the mainspring rivet attempted to pass each of the motor pillars! Ha! The way I fixed mine was to simply (and carefully) hand file the top of the rivet and voila! Fixed!

Anyway, yours is a transitional model. A good find and thanks again for sharing the pictures.

Doug


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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Sat May 27, 2017 10:05 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 574
Brad: Thanks for the offer. I shall remember that you have parts for such machines. I understand why you don't want to remove the one corner molding from an otherwise good case. I wouldn't either.

Doug: It never occurred to me that you had suggested the motor might be swapped. That was just me wondering about the machine. I think we've all seen machines with practically everything and anything done to them. So every time I get something new or unfamiliar I become worried that I wasted my money on some non-original contraption, which to me is just a bunch of parts even if it works. That was just me worrying that the motor was swapped out. I was expecting the earlier type of motor. Anyway, thanks for the info about the different models. (Ditto to Harvey.) I do believe a couple of years ago I did see a Model A in a much larger case. I backed off because I did not know what i was looking at. However, I really don't know what the orientation of the motor was.

I mentioned that I got this machine at an auction on the Eastern Shore. I also got a Columbia AU and a Std Model X2. And a beat up Cirola portable. There were many other interesting items at this auction including much early lighting (whale oil, e.g.). There was a pretty little complete Gem with a black case. I did not bid on it. Also there was a tabletop Orophone, a very interesting machine that went for a reasonable price but I was busy blowing my budget on other things. Also a VV-50 in oak. Really great stuff in rundown condition ready to be brought back to life--just the way I like to find them.

When I find the time I will work on the Cirola first. The shellac needs to be re-almalgamated. I shall post pictures when I can. I got this thing called a job that keeps getting in the way.


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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Sun Jun 11, 2017 12:21 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 574
Here's the machine cleaned up a bit. The motor was disassembled, clean, oiled and put back in good runner order. And the reproducer has been rebuilt. This is the a later model Standard A. It has a superior motor compared to the earlier Model As. You can see the piece of corner moulding that is missing. I also have a small veneering job to do.At an auction that had everything covered with old soot from a fire, I managed to pick up two Columbia client cases. These were in absolutely miserable shape (really, just dilapidated old cases). But then they were only $2 for the pair. I hope I have some good veneer that I can use. We'll see when I get around to it. As for now this is a player.


Attachments:
std3.jpg
std3.jpg [ 54.24 KiB | Viewed 299 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 9:46 pm 
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Victor I
Joined: Sun Jan 01, 2017 5:27 pm
Posts: 146
Location: Tennessee
I have a standard A just like this (speed adjust on top rather than front). I thought that was found on the 1st versions? Am I wrong? ( I probaly am). Please any info would be appreciated.

T


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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Mon Jun 12, 2017 9:56 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 574
The one discussed in this thread is a later version. The first version had a brake/speed control rod that stuck out in the front. There are other differences as well. And I've discovered that even the same models may have small differences in their motors.


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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Fri Jul 14, 2017 11:33 am 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 574
Here is a photo of my machine now with a "new" corner on. I thank Randy of Phoenix for that. Not sure when I will get around to the veneer on the top. Might resist the urge to "improve" and just leave it alone. I've also included a photo of my new Cirola. It was bought at the same auction. So far I have removed the old shellac with a brush and ethanol as it was badly alligatored and discolored. This is a gentle process. Also some of the corners of the case had come loose and now have been squared up and reglued with hide glue. Broken mainspring. Also from the same auction I got a Standard Model X2, which see silouhette (sp?). I had to buy two lots in order to bring the horn and elbow back to the case and reproducer as the auctioneer did not know what went with what. He had mixed the horn (with elbow) with three other horns in a single lot. As if that weren't enough, I even got a Columbia AU. I hope I got the model right. this is a front mount disk machine with an open mainspring. I haven't gotten around to that machine yet, but needs a good bath.

Sorry about the inverted photos. I tried flipping them over before uploading them. Didn't work. I took the picture of the Model A with my cell phone in the upright position, and the photo came out normal. I took the other two pictures holding the cell phone sidewise. I think that may be the problem. Perhaps the digitized coordinates of each pixel are inverted? I'll see if I can fix this later.

Later. Aha! Some success. I believe the problem with inverted photos lies in the address of each pixel: they're inverted when the camera is rotated. X becomes y. so then one needs to rotate the picture, save it, then upload to this forum.


Attachments:
IMG_0188.JPG
IMG_0188.JPG [ 101.9 KiB | Viewed 228 times ]
IMG_0189.JPG
IMG_0189.JPG [ 134.79 KiB | Viewed 228 times ]
IMG_0187.JPG
IMG_0187.JPG [ 103.26 KiB | Viewed 246 times ]
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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Sat Jul 15, 2017 10:33 am 
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Victor IV
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Joined: Sun Jul 29, 2012 10:35 pm
Posts: 1008
Location: Northwest New Jersey
Looks great!
A story with a very happy ending.

Gene


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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 7:18 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 574
Doug: I now have that last model you describe. Got it yesterday at an auction in a very dilapidated state. I had to buy a Fireside with an Ediphone reproducer along with it as well as some cylinders. The cylinders were wrapped in old newspaper from 1969. I believe that is when all this stuff was put away in a non-working condition. The Model A is complete, well, no horn, but the governor is off. All the veneer on the top is present but some of it is peeling. I believe I can reset it. Mud wasps got into it and left the remains of their "homes". I'll post photos when I can. Thought you might find this interesting.


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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 8:20 pm 
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Victor III
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Joined: Tue Jul 07, 2009 7:22 pm
Posts: 919
jboger wrote:
Doug: I now have that last model you describe. Got it yesterday at an auction


Congratulations! It's a rare bird in almost any condition. Here's a video I posted not too long ago on my YouTube channel showing mine along with one of the common Standard Model A's in my collection:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hecKa6Yh2Zk

I'll be interested to see your pictures as well as the motor in yours as the motor should be considerably different relative to the common Columbia motor in most Standard A's.

Best,
Doug


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 Post subject: Re: Standard Model A with Green Horn
PostPosted: Wed Oct 11, 2017 9:27 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Tue Jun 24, 2014 10:12 pm
Posts: 574
Thank you for that video. Very informative. I had to go into the garage where it is disassembled to see if I in fact had a decal with the Dearborn address. Yes indeed I do. The motor is boxlike cage with four pillars. It is held to the motor board with three bolts, not the usual four. The mainspring barrel is parallel with the motor board. And I have the same brake/speed control. Your observation about color agrees with mine: my early models are dark; this new one is considerably lighter, more of a light golden brown.

I did take some "before" pictures. I will try to upload them tomorrow


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