Columbia BS Coin-Op - Reproduction Machine?

[MikeB]

In another topic, I read, to my horror, that Columbia BS machines had been reproduced in the 1980's. I was not aware that the entire machine had been reproduced, and I fear that I may have one. So, I need your help.

I have attached many pictures of my machine here. I was led to believe that it was an original machine when purchased. It was clear that the signboard was a reproduction, so this was never in issue. I also assumed that the internal parts had been reconditioned/re-plated, while other parts of the machine were reproductions. As I was unaware that these entire machines had been reproduced, this did not occur to me. The data plate is incorrect and has only the "B" designation and an improper serial number for this machine. I now understand that this is an indication of a reproduction machine. There are aspects of the case that look aged to me, but I'm not sure.

I was wondering what the consensus is regarding the machine, and was also wondering if anyone has any photos/advertisements for one of the known reproduction machines, particularly photos of the data plate. If the data plates were mass-produced on the reproductions, I am even wondering whether the serial numbers on the reproduction machines might conceivably be all the same.

If the entire machine is indeed a reproduction, then I will need to work this out with the seller.

Thanks for your help.

[Curt A]

One thing that looks suspect immediately, are the Philips head screws attaching the feet... also, the brass nuts on the bottom, where I would expect steel nuts, but I am not an expert on these machines.

[JerryVan]

This just an observation from someone who does not currently own such a machine and is NOT an expert on them in any way. My opinion. The pieces that are in common with an ordinary B look like original parts. The pieces that are unique to the BS look new. At the very least, the plating, if not their overall appearance in general. The cabinet looks original. The Phillips head screws holding the feet on are obviously wrong. Again, my uninformed opinion, someone had a B and a BS cabinet, then ordered the coin-op parts to make a BS.

The governor bearings also look very strange and collars are not nickel plated. The screws also appear to be cadmium plated. Wondering also about the unplated brass risers under the motor side plates.

[TinfoilPhono]

^^^^
My thoughts exactly. The cabinet looks original, the feet definitely aren't and the coin parts look new. I suspect someone had an empty original cabinet (without the feet) and put together a BS using a donor Type B along with some new coin parts. The mystery is why the original BS plate would have been removed from the cabinet.

[JerryVan]

^^^^
My thoughts exactly. The cabinet looks original, the feet definitely aren't and the coin parts look new. I suspect someone had an empty original cabinet (without the feet) and put together a BS using a donor Type B along with some new coin parts. The mystery is why the original BS plate would have been removed from the cabinet.

The cabinet was probably stripped out and the parts sold individually, as most likely the feet were as well. We've all seen such things on eBay.

[oldphonographsteve]

I also do not own a Columbia BS myself, however, if the machine were indeed a complete reproduction the finish on the oak would intrigue me. The oak is a dark reddish brown color which usually only comes with age. All oak machines that I have seen refinished have had a lighter color like when they were new. I would suggest taking a close look at the finish and seeing if you can discern any unevenness in color or lighter areas where the sun would be less likely to redden the oak. If that checks out the machine may well be at least partially original.

-Stephen

[phonogfp]

I agree with Rene and Jerry:

ORIGINAL:
B mechanism
Cabinet

REPRODUCTION:
Coin-op parts
Feet
Signboard

ORIGINAL BUT NOT APPROPRIATE:
Data plate

If this machine were mine, I'd obtain a data plate with a number above 145000 and substitute it for the current one. It would still be stamped "B" but at least it would be historically appropriate. I'd also replace those Phillips-head screws holding the feet.

It's not a bad machine, and it's still a BS. They're fun to watch.

George P.

[JerryVan]

... and it's still a BS.

George P.

Really???

[phonogfp]

... and it's still a BS.

George P.

Really???

Well, it's an original BS cabinet, and the playing mechanism is the same. If it was sold as an original BS, there's a problem.

George P.

[MikeB]

Thanks, everyone. I really appreciate these observations.

Knowing that the machine is not an outright reproduction actually makes me feel better. I am still very curious about the reproduction machines from the 1980's, though, so if anyone has any pictures and/or information regarding these machines, please share.

My initial impression of this machine was that it was a legitimate coin-op, but that many of the parts had been replaced or reconditioned. I am wondering if anyone else thinks that this is a possibility. (I am suggesting that this may have started life as a parts machine in the current cabinet; perhaps a badly damaged BS with non-functional or missing coin-op and other parts,and that someone may have gone in and replaced much of this machine to make it functional again). Of course, this would not explain the incorrect data plate, however it technically would make it an original BS, perhaps...

If this is not a possibility, and that this machine was cobbled together and started life as something else, then yes, there would be an issue.

Thoughts?