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 Post subject: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gears
PostPosted: Thu May 03, 2018 9:25 pm 
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Victor II
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Location: Florida
Hello All,

I see and know of various activities ongoing at present regarding reproducing the 5 pot metal parts and the gears, and I applaud all efforts. I currently have a set of Charlie Weatherbee's cast aluminum set installed and working very nicely in a VE 10-50 I currently have listed on eBay. I also have many other VE 10-50, VE 9-55, and 10-70 machines that need these parts and felt it would be less expensive if I got them mass produced than if I bought them at the rate Charlie sold them for (due to being labor intense by milling his own gears) and others being sold. Also, since I have good originals as well, I felt I would start fresh and have the original design mass reproduced.

Last week I paid the 50% deposit for a local aluminum foundry to create a pattern with all 5 pot metal parts for a slightly hefty price of $2800. Additionally, they did a calculation based on producing 10 sets an hour, the effort in cleaning and polishing them up, and the drilling and tapping of the holes to give me a per-5-piece-set price. I felt the initial cost, the per-5-piece-set price, and the cost of a set of 4 gears was worth it for my needs. Also, I felt others could benefit from this effort and that I possibly would make these available to you and other folks at hopefully the lowest price out there and get quality parts at the same time. At least, you will have choice, and choice has been slim to come by.

I am working out the gear issue at present. I have a VE 9-55 with brass gears and I would like to buy similar off the shelf quality brass gears to match up with the aluminum cast reproduction parts. I have ordered a set of 4 and they are on there way here to give them a try. If these don't work, then my intention is to recreate the originals in cast aluminum by the lost wax method.

-Wayne


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 9:26 am 
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Victor V
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 3:47 am
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Location: Jerome, Arizona
You may want to investigate CAD and replicating then by 3-D printing. There are metal 3D printers. The CAD method would allow you to oversize the printed model to compensate for shrinkage in casting.
"All of us have a place in history. Mine is clouds." Richard Brautigan


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Fri May 04, 2018 9:59 am 
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Victor II
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Location: Florida
JohnM wrote:
You may want to investigate CAD and replicating then by 3-D printing. There are metal 3D printers. The CAD method would allow you to oversize the printed model to compensate for shrinkage in casting.


I am assured by the foundry that the final product will be exact replicas. Their craftsman is a very talent Chineseman that will make the pattern 1% bigger to address shrinkage. I will be using my digital caliper to verify exact measurements. They indicated they will make whatever adjustments to the pattern to insure not only the precision but also operability after testing out the products in multiple machines. I have had two changes implemented in the requirements for the pattern. The record lift base and the gear base are to be made solid versus hollow.

I talked in length about 3D printing with the foundry. From what he said, he is not satisfied on where the technology is currently on any metal reproductions due to its layering method of manufacturing and it’s tendency to delaminate. He knows however his Chineseman craftsman is not a job skill that would be easily be replaced. So he would likely use 3D printing in the making of plastic patterns to be used in the process of sand casting to insure the durability of the final product, when his employee retires.


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Sat May 05, 2018 6:21 pm 
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Victor II
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OK, so we have several projects going. This is good. So I will ask the question that is on EVERYONE's mind. When will you have parts to make an evaluations and calculate pricing?
Always looking for a Columbia 820

"The two most important days in your life are the day you are born and the day you find out why.”― Mark Twain


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2018 8:39 am 
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Victor II
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Location: Florida
maginter wrote:
When will you have parts to make an evaluations and calculate pricing?


The foundry indicated 10 days ago, they could start it in a few days and possibly have the pattern made within a week. I will check with them this week. I'm hoping to use off the shelf brass gears and will find that out soon too. I imagine I will be able to answer your question within the next couple weeks. Price wise, I am definitely shooting for significantly less than current or past prices.


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2018 9:30 am 
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Victor II
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Cool! We look forward to your progress!
Always looking for a Columbia 820

"The two most important days in your life are the day you are born and the day you find out why.”― Mark Twain


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Sun May 06, 2018 9:26 pm 
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Victor IV
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Location: Plover, WI
Wayne,
I applaud your efforts on this project. I am sure that there will be several collectors that could use a set. Keep us all informed on this project and when sets will be available.


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 3:13 pm 
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Victor II
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Good news on the gears. My Boston Gear brass gears arrived today and they are an exact match (other than bore size and not having a pin hole) to the ones that go to my VE 9-55, see photo below. Also, the new gears have the model numbers stamped on them while the 9-55 gears don’t. The 9-55 gear set has a gear base that someone had casted. They drilled out the small gear side of the base (see photo) a little bit to allow that small gear to be recessed enough to line up with the gear on the underside of the changer. The new gears have bore sizes of .188” and .250” and need to be drilled out to slightly bigger than .250” and .375”. The model numbers of the new gears are G485Y-P and G485Y-G, and cost me $115 a 4 gear set. Aside from boring the gears bigger, they will need pin holes drilled through the hub part, so they could be pinned in place as the original gears were.

Note that a few years ago someone told me that the HL147Y-P and HL-147Y-G steel gears would work, so back then, I posted that info here on TMF. I recently ordered those gears and found that they don’t work and are not a good candidate at all. The outside diameters are much smaller than originals, (these brass ones are the same OD) and the bore sizes on those steel gears are not right and drilling out would not be an option for the small gear.


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 5:26 pm 
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Victor IV
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Location: Plover, WI
Great news Wayne!!! Please keep us all informed with any further progress. There definitely will be a demand for sets.


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 Post subject: Re: Victor Changer Type 1 Pot Metal Replacement Parts & Gear
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 10:44 pm 
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Victor II
A man is not a man who does not make the world a better place
Joined: Thu Jan 15, 2009 7:46 pm
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Location: Arizona
Hi All,
Wayne, I am glad that you are working in this area along with all the efforts of others. I have elected to go the 3-D route and all files have been already created for all 10 parts that are made from pot metal including the handle. There are concerns about costs (do not know about that yet) but all the file creation has been paid for. The other day they set up a program so that I could see the gears mesh and run.

I know that there have been concerns with delamination, but that occurs mostly with ABS materials, Parts will be weighed and materials that meet that need will be used. I am looking at mostly using tool steel, but many of the substrates that are a form of metal/plastic are very strong-25,000 PSI.

One of my neighbors firm creates dies for steel stamping and he uses the company that I am working with to make parts that are highly stressed and they have no problems. In fact they make parts for the aerospace industry. We are currently working on the hole placement for the gear pins, and the threading for set screws and screws.

A cost analysis will be done shortly for making the actual parts and I will keep everyone posted-I am leaving for a 50th wedding anniversary trip shortly and may not have that information to post before I get back. In any case unless the cost blows me away parts could be ready by mid June or sooner-and they will be to 1/1000th" correct.

Abe


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