The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

It is currently Sun Dec 09, 2018 9:47 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 10:44 pm 
Offline
Victor Jr
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:48 am
Posts: 8
..and a tube.

The motor seems to run fine when the reproducer is not in contact,but stops almost instantly when the reproducer makes contact with the tube.We've tried adjusting the screw that seems to tension the belt,but it doesnt seem to change anything.When the motors running,it makes a "chug chug chug" sound,if that means anything.

Any help would be appreciated


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:01 pm 
Offline
Victor Monarch Special
Stop for a visit when in Oregon.
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 12:25 pm
Posts: 5748
Location: Albany, Oregon
I think the "H" you refer to is the model of reproducer not the model of the machine. That's an easy mistake to make. If you posted a photo of the machine and ID tag we could help with the model.

The carriage with reproducer moves across the record because of the feed screw. There is a small screw which adjusts the amount of weight or contact between the carriage's half nut and the feed screw. The "half nut" is the part that actually contacts the feed screw. If you look there is a little set screw which adjusts the amount of contact. It is a very fine adjustment.

The thumping sound is caused by dry grease. The spring needs to be cleaned and re-lubricated.

Welcome to the Forum. Jerry Blais


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Mon May 14, 2018 11:34 pm 
Offline
Victor Jr
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:48 am
Posts: 8
heres a couple pics


Attachments:
IMG_1430.JPG
IMG_1430.JPG [ 1.52 MiB | Viewed 500 times ]
IMG_1429.JPG
IMG_1429.JPG [ 1021.9 KiB | Viewed 500 times ]
IMG_1428.JPG
IMG_1428.JPG [ 1.07 MiB | Viewed 500 times ]
Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 12:32 am 
Offline
Victor V
User avatar
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2010 1:17 am
Posts: 2949
Location: Where there's "hamburger ALL OVER the highway"...
That's a Model B.

First of all, have you cleaned the motor and upper works yet? If not, you should do so. Remove, clean, and reinstall the mainspring as well, lubricating it with a good grade of grease (lithium or molybdenum are good). The rest should be lubricated with fine sewing machine oil.

If it still bogs down, you can adjust the pressure on the half nut, using the screw on its spring mount: alternatively, check the mandrel bearings on either end, and adjust them until it runs properly.

Bill


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 12:52 am 
Offline
Victor IV
User avatar
Those who were seen dancing were thought insane by those who could not hear the music. Nietzsche
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:55 am
Posts: 1306
Location: Tucson, AZ
This is required reading for knowing what you have...
https://www.antiquephono.org/spotters-g ... honograph/
and
https://www.antiquephono.org/basic-anti ... onal-tips/

James.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 1:47 am 
Offline
Victor Jr
Joined: Wed Jun 28, 2017 9:48 am
Posts: 8
we havent cleaned anything.We dont know very little about the workings or what the individual parts are called.We are really in the dark on this,so the more info the better.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 3:15 am 
Offline
Victor IV
User avatar
A Hobbyist Specializing in Sales and Repair of Spring Motor Phonographs
Joined: Sun Feb 12, 2012 11:43 am
Posts: 1775
Location: Castle Rock, WA
Your Model B was originally made to play only 2 minute cylinders. Someone has installed the Edison 2/4 minute adaptor kit so now if will play both 2 and 4 minute cylinders. That is very good! One thing that is really common is the gears in the adaptor assembly become gunked up and create significant drag on the motor.

You can easily test to see if the gears are gunked up. Slip the belt off the mandrel pulley and with the end gate closed, spin the mandrel by hand. It should spin freely, it should continue spinning for a second or two after you've spun it. If there is any appreciable drag, your upper gears need to be cleaned and oiled. Also, be sure to oil the mandrel shaft at the end gate.

Don't know if this is your problem, but it is the easiest to check and fix. If this doesn't help, then check the reproducer carriage feednut adjustment, as mentioned in previous replies. Also check that the half nut and drive screw surfaces are clean and free of rust and debris. Be sure to oil each end of the drive screw shaft.
Cliff's Vintage Music Shoppe, Castle Rock, WA
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QIz_IpaVrW8


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 5:57 am 
Offline
Victor Monarch Special
User avatar
Who is John Galt?
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 6:08 pm
Posts: 5541
Location: New York's Finger Lakes
You have received good advice. Do yourself a favor and read the two articles recommended above. The cylinder record currently in place on your Standard Model B is a TWO-MINUTE variety, but the Model H Reproducer is for FOUR-MINUTE cylinders.

The Amberol Attachment installed on your Standard B enables the machine to play either TWO-MINUTE or FOUR-MINUTE cylinders, but only with the proper reproducer. Pull out the little knob to the left for FOUR-MINUTE records; push it in toward the right for TWO-MINUTE records.

To play the TWO-MINUTE record currently on your machine, you'll need the proper reproducer. A Model C will be the most common and least expensive choice (usually around $90-$125). Or, simply obtain some FOUR-MINUTE cylinder records - preferably Edison Blue Amberols. These are made of celluloid, very durable, and typically retail for less than $5 apiece.

Again, read the two articles recommended above and you'll have an understanding of what's involved. Good luck!

George P.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 7:18 am 
Offline
Victor IV
User avatar
A new blank with authentic formula and spiral core!
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 10:50 am
Posts: 1402
Location: 615 1/2 South Main Street Princeton IL 61356.
The H reproducer plays four minute cylinder records. The record you have on the machine is a two minute record usually a black metallic soap (called wax) and the end is rounded over, and it has no plaster core, these made from 1902-1912, and have 100 threads per inch. Two minute records are to be played with the plunger with the gears pushed all the way in, and with a model C reproducer. A four minute records have 4m written on them if they are black and of a wax-like soap material, They have a flat end, with titles written on them this is a four minute record or blue celluloid record with plaster core. (if you play a four minute record, the gearing plunger is pulled out to the left, and a model H reproducer used. I have included a link to a page I made to identify different records and how they are to be played, playing a record with the wrong reproducer will ruin the record, playing an 2 minute Edison Gold Moluded record with an H will ruin the grooves, it is only to be played with a model C (C written on the weight of the reproducer.) http://members.tripod.com/~Edison_1/id16.html


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Hi recently got an edison standard model h phonograph
PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 3:12 pm 
Offline
Victor II
User avatar
Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 12:24 pm
Posts: 224
I can think of an even simpler possible solution to the playback problem. You see that metal piece with a little knob at the end mounted on a post to the right of the cylinder? The one that is pointing to the right in your photo? That's called an "end gate." It swings to the position where you're showing it so that you can put cylinders (the records, what you called the "tube") on the mandrel, the metal cylinder that holds and spins the record--the cylinder player's equivalent of a turntable's platter. Well, before *playing* the record, you must swing the end gate to the end of the mandrel until it snaps firmly into place and won't move. You see the point sticking out from the right of the mandrel? That's supposed to fit into the little metal cup, or bearing, about midway along the length of the end gate, just beneath the set screw and at the point where the end gate does a little dogleg bend. Unless the end gate is in place, the machine will not be able to play cylinders. To remove the cylinder after play, you swing the gate back to where you are showing it.

What others have said about the 2-minute cylinder on your machine is correct: it's not right for your reproducer. I'll just add that you can also play *wax* four-minute records, called simply "amberol"; they usually have a flat end and bear the marking "4M" somewhere around the catalogue number. Note that they are extremely brittle and hence easily broken; they also wear quickly in play. That's why Edison abandoned them for the "blue amberol" celluloid type.

And what, you ask, is a "reproducer"? It's the mechanical phonograph equivalent of a modern turntable's phono cartridge, the part that makes contact with the record and converts mechanical movement into a signal (in this case, sound) for amplification (through the horn). In your case, it's that round, silver pillbox thing with the little fishtail weight screwed into that black metal arch, called a "carrier," that goes over the record in play. Did your machine come with a horn? If not, you'll need one to hear the music. The most modest and cheapest type, readily available in reproductions, is a ca. 12"-14" long cone with a brass bell; it slips right onto the little tube extending from the top of the reproducer. You'll get much better results with a larger horn, but that will be more expensive and require some sort of gantry, or "crane," to support it.

I should mention that one part of that gearing at the left of the mandrel can shift to the left or right; that's how you change between two-minute and four-minute playback. In Edison's system, the record carries the weight of the stylus, but the machine mechanically moves the reproducer across the surface of the record by means of a "feed screw," a long rod threaded to match the 100 groove cut (or "thread") per inch standard for 2-minute cylinders. As it rotates, it pushes the carrier to the right at the correct rate to keep the reproducer, and hence stylus, more or less centered on the groove. To double the playing time to four minutes, Edison cut the groove spacing in half: 200 threads per inch. To keep the mechanical feed in synch, you select the gears at the end of the mandrel to cut the speed of the feed screw's rotation by half as well, so the carrier moves across the cylinder only half as fast.

One final point: your machine is missing a non-essential part, a metal cover for the gears at the left end of the mandrel. These are available as reproductions, and you may want to consider adding one to protect the gears and prevent inadvertent finger pinches--ouch!

I hope some of this is a help. Welcome to the wonderful world of cylinder phono ownership!


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 18 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Baidu [Spider], Bing [Bot], Google [Bot] and 9 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Americanized by Maël Soucaze.