The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 10:00 am 
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Victor IV
Joined: Sat Jul 09, 2016 7:12 pm
Posts: 1324
Vinrage_mania wrote:
All this is in FTFTS ....but back to records ....what % of “deco” Decca records circa 1935-6 vs other labels do we see?
Ortho fan you are SF Bay area like me (I think) seems like more later 40s stuff to me


You're right. FTTS provides a very comprehensive history of radio's impact on the phonograph industry, which I summarized in my response.

Over the 30 years I've lived in the Bay area, most of the Decca records I've spotted were from the late 1930s/early 40s. I've probably come across maybe about 50-100 star burst blue labels from the mid-1930s, though surprisingly few black labels from the 40s. I have to confess, though, I've never acquired many Decca records, and have concentrated more on the Orthophonic/Viva Tonal labels since they sound better on an Orthophonic Victrola. Many years ago, though, I used to visit a local collector who had hundreds of Decca records from the mid 1930s, but that was out of a collection of tens of thousands of 78s.

OrthoFan


Last edited by OrthoFan on Mon Aug 06, 2018 5:44 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 11:01 am 
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Victor II
Joined: Sat Apr 20, 2013 3:01 pm
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Location: Coos Bay, Oregon
Part of the reason the records from the Orthophonic era are harder to find today, was due to the massive call to turn in those records during WW2. The shellac was re-cycled for products essential to war production. Drives were organized in major metropolitan areas across the country, where they were sorted by material, and some were rejected for being the wrong material (such as the earlier rubber compounds). Another reason is cost/necessity. After 1929 and up to just before WW2, finances were tight for most of the world, and the USA was known to have suffered the direst of times in that period. Records were not an essential item to most Americans, which significantly reduced the size of the record buying group.

The effect that radio had on record sales was likely two fold, each effect contradictory to the other. One, radio allowed the smaller group of people who were receptive to buying records, to conveniently hear a tune, that they might not hear any other way. In turn that would create the "desire to own" a copy which they could hear any time they wanted without having to wait. Two, part of the population would be satisfied with hearing whatever tunes were aired on the radio, and might never develop a desire, or have the ability, to own a copy of a particular tune.


Another example of how that works, can be found in the jukebox industry. There, the latest records could be heard, after paying for it to play. That in turn stimulated record sales for most, but not all of the musically inclined public.


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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 4:55 pm 
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Victor IV
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I have a binder of every Talking Machine Monthly from the year of 1928. From the ads, if you can't see that radio is taking over from the phonograph, you are blind. There are exceptions, such as ads for the Edison Edisonic machines, but hand crank machines are definitely dying.


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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 7:30 pm 
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Victor I
to own an electrola is a blessing
Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2018 6:50 pm
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marcapra wrote:
I have a binder of every Talking Machine Monthly from the year of 1928. From the ads, if you can't see that radio is taking over from the phonograph, you are blind. There are exceptions, such as ads for the Edison Edisonic machines, but hand crank machines are definitely dying.

Radio BROADCASTS may have hurt the talking machine but radio TECHNOLOGY gave the phonograph a shot in the arm


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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Mon Aug 06, 2018 7:40 pm 
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Victor I
to own an electrola is a blessing
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victor 15-1 wrote:
marcapra wrote:
I have a binder of every Talking Machine Monthly from the year of 1928. From the ads, if you can't see that radio is taking over from the phonograph, you are blind. There are exceptions, such as ads for the Edison Edisonic machines, but hand crank machines are definitely dying.

Radio BROADCASTS may have hurt the talking machine but radio TECHNOLOGY gave the phonograph a shot in the arm

Radio did not kill the talking machine..the stock market crash killed it


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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 9:57 am 
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VTLA
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There was definitely a 10 year slump for records after the radio gained popularity in the late 1920s. The stock market crash probably had an even bigger impact, because record sales came back when the economy improved. There are so many records still around from the mid to late 1930s and from the 1940s, so sales definitely had recovered by then. At that point I also thing that the radio helped boost record sales by broadcasting music everywhere thus creating demand for the records. Best documented example is probably Elvis Presley's rise to stardom from a single record played on a small local radio station. It probably took a while for the record companies to realize the marketing potential of the new medium radio, after first viewing it as competition and enemy.

Andreas


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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 12:35 pm 
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Victor I
to own an electrola is a blessing
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alang wrote:
There was definitely a 10 year slump for records after the radio gained popularity in the late 1920s. The stock market crash probably had an even bigger impact, because record sales came back when the economy improved. There are so many records still around from the mid to late 1930s and from the 1940s, so sales definitely had recovered by then. At that point I also thing that the radio helped boost record sales by broadcasting music everywhere thus creating demand for the records. Best documented example is probably Elvis Presley's rise to stardom from a single record played on a small local radio station. It probably took a while for the record companies to realize the marketing potential of the new medium radio, after first viewing it as competition and enemy.

Andreas

In the late summer of 1928 at a stockholder's meeting (radio by this time was firmly established)president Schumacher of Victor boasted to those at the meeting that 1928 was the best year in over a decade for the company.Orthophonic recording,tie ups with the infant talking picture industry and the signing of new fresh talent was a windfall for the company.
In looking through all issues of radio retailing magazine from jan 1928 to Dec 1929 one sees countless ads for electric phonograph related equipment from Pacent,Audak,Webster, Erla ,Phonovox as well as 15 new radio phonographs in the October 1928 issue.
Even companies that did not produce records offered electric phonographs..Capehart,Mills,Sparton,Steinite Sonora saw that radio was an ally,not a threat to their business.It was the economy,not the competition of radio that made records luxury that by the summer of 1930 everyone could do without.

Edison closed down operations after the stock market crash because of the crash,not because of competition from radio.His market share was almost nil and with a few notable exceptions could not draw the talent so he may not have survived anyway should the pre depression robust nature of the economy continued


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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Tue Aug 07, 2018 10:56 pm 
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Victor V
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Location: NW Indiana B-19;VV-IV; VV-VI;VV-XVI; Edison Home B; Amberola 30; Col. BK; Magnola;
RCA’s David Sarnoff seemed to despise the record, until he came out with the 45 around 1949. The 45 fueled by jukeboxes and small 45 players.

On the other hand, Edison seems to have disliked radio in the early to mid 20’s and seemed to take it as a threat to the record.


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 Post subject: Re: Radio killed the Talking Machine!
PostPosted: Wed Aug 08, 2018 9:03 am 
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Victor IV
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 8:44 pm
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As a long time fan of both Radio and Records my take is that as Radio became the rage peoples priorities changed in which was to spend your evenings or days. I still have that problem. Only so many hours in a day, now the Computer sometimes take president over how my evenings will be spent, let alone days. The Records sit gathering dust and my vast collection of Old Radio shows also tend to mostly occupy shelf space now. I usually listen to the likes of Broadway, My Beat or a Comedy show of the 40's when I have to concentrate on making the True Tone diaphragms. They past the time and entertain as well. People in the Radio Era didn't have near the distractions and could devote much of the time to listening to radio as a family. Getting up every few minutes to change and crank the phonograph in order to be entertained probably helped to cause a drop in popularity of records . After the depression and the newness of Radio had waned people began to return to collecting records again. Auto changers for records probably helped to sell records to the public once again.


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