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 Post subject: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2019 3:44 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:23 pm
Posts: 30
Location: Louisville, KY
I have been working on an Amberola 30 for some time. This week I assembled it to give it a test run and found that it ran backwards.

When I turn the winding crank, it doesn’t wind the spring. After taking it apart I found that the click assembly is working correctly. I can wind the barrel in my hands and recognize power; however, it is in the wrong direction.

I have removed the winding gear and the center arbor but can’t seem to get the barrel open. I am wondering if the end of the spring is catching or if it has come loose from the barrel.
Please help me understand how the barrel comes open and how the spring should be arranged inside.


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2019 4:04 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Mon Jun 28, 2010 12:12 pm
Posts: 809
Location: Lubbock, Texas
My suggestion is to call Ron Sitko for help. His telephone number is in the links section of the forum.


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2019 9:53 pm 
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Victor IV
Joined: Wed May 20, 2009 8:20 pm
Posts: 1125
Location: Mid - Michigan
Under the gear is a plate that is held to the barrel by 3 tabs which are bent over the edge of the barrel. They need to be carefully bent back to gain access to the spring.

Jim


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Mon May 13, 2019 10:15 pm 
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Victor IV
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"A Phonograph in every home..."
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 8:02 pm
Posts: 1043
Location: Melbourne, FL (Former New Yorker!)
It sounds like a previous owner installed the Mainspring in the Mainspring Barrel upside down... Just a guess...

You are turning the outside Hand crank in a Clockwise direction....Right?!???

Just asking..


:o)

Tony K.

Edison Collector/Restorer


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 8:32 am 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:23 pm
Posts: 30
Location: Louisville, KY
As I turn the winding crank clockwise, the spring barrel turns counter (anti) clockwise. I hold the drive gear and the spring does not wind. Listening carefully I can't hear the spring slipping over a catch on the inside of the barrel.

Maybe the center of the spring has come off it's catch?


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 8:51 am 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:23 pm
Posts: 30
Location: Louisville, KY
Welcome to the inside of this spring barrel!!

Thank you Phonojim for the key. (I think)

I have seen this happen inside a spring barrel on a music box when there was a runaway (machine spinning at an un-governed speed). The spring end has unwound, hopped off the center tab and caught on itself. No way to release it but to open the spring barrel and release it.

Now I am thinking the main spring will need to come out and reinstalled after everything is cleaned and re-lubricated properly. I have removed and re-installed large music box springs.

The question is: what is this lubricant?


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 9:03 am 
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Victor II
Martin - 16 y/o
Joined: Mon May 07, 2018 6:27 pm
Posts: 422
Frank W wrote:
Welcome to the inside of this spring barrel!!

Thank you Phonojim for the key. (I think)

I have seen this happen inside a spring barrel on a music box when there was a runaway (machine spinning at an un-governed speed). The spring end has unwound, hopped off the center tab and caught on itself. No way to release it but to open the spring barrel and release it.

Now I am thinking the main spring will need to come out and reinstalled after everything is cleaned and re-lubricated properly. I have removed and re-installed large music box springs.

The question is: what is this lubricant?

Yes, the spring had to come out, but be very careful, the spring can rapidly unwind out of the barrel and reek havoc. The original spring grease is a mix of 10:1 vaseline and graphite powder. The topic of grease choices is very controversial, but you cant go wrong with the original formula.

In my experience, Mobil-1 grease works extremely well for 1 spring Edison motors, but others here might oppose.

Martin


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 9:38 am 
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Victor IV
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"A Phonograph in every home..."
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 8:02 pm
Posts: 1043
Location: Melbourne, FL (Former New Yorker!)
The Lubricant is an Original 1 to 1 (1:1) Ratio of Vaseline to Black Graphite. It's Edison's Original Formula. It works, but it's an unholy mess and Modern Lubricants work much better.

I and a few others tend to go with Castrol GTX Brown Bearing Grease in a Tub. The container looks like this pictured below. It's a wonderful modern alternative, looks great, works fabulous and won't break down...

:o)

Tony K.

Edison Collector/Restorer


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 11:09 am 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:23 pm
Posts: 30
Location: Louisville, KY
After I get the mess clean up, then I will have to consider the lubricant. Thanks all for the input. I have graphite and Vaseline. Will look into the Castrol bearing grease.

Applied in the barrel, then on the spring, (wind the spring back into the barrel) then a glob in the barrel over the spring for good measure. Does that sound about right?


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 Post subject: Re: Help - Amberola Main Spring Barrel
PostPosted: Tue May 14, 2019 11:26 am 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Tue Jan 10, 2017 3:23 pm
Posts: 30
Location: Louisville, KY
... and the reason for this screw opening?


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