Edison Spring Motor/Triumph Questionnaire

[Discman]

Brad,
We must have ESP because I was wondering the same thing. Here's a picture of mine, it's hard to tell if it's a 6 or 8, it is closed at the top like an 8 on my plate.

[Brad]

It is harder to tell on your plate, mine is clearly a "6". I notice that there are several other entries on the thread with May 22, 1906 and 1908.

I guess George has some sluethin' to do!

[phonogfp]

Thanks guys. The correct date is May 22, 1906. I've had several collectors submit the later date, but I knew it was 1906. It's hard to tell on some plates. No problem!

One kind contributor had a similar problem with a couple of "3s". He thought they were "8s" and it's an easy mistake to make. However, substituting an "8" for a "3" in a serial number can turn a model A into a model F! I checked back, the patient collector sent me a photo of his data plate, and the mystery was solved.

Those numbers are tiny!

George P.

[JerryVan]

Here's some Spring Motor Data;

1. s/n 24380
2. Boss
3. Jan. 5, 1897
4. 2 screws
5. Class M lugs
6. Ball type catch
7. When I got this SM it had a carriage with the 2:00 set screw. I fealt it was wrong and put a nickled clip style carriage on it. Interested in what you deem correct, given your research.
8. 2581
9. Spoked
10. EDISON SPRING MOTOR
FOR PHONOGRAPH
Patented Oct.27.1896
Jan.5.1897
11. Drawer
12. No

Thanks.

[drboruff]

George,

Below is information on a Triumph Model A/B transition. This example also has a square shaft crank vs. threaded. I have a Model A with banner front decal I'll dig out and send information on this weekend.

Thanks.
David Boruff


1) Serial number (found on top): 45,198
2) Is serial number stamped in a plate, or a raised boss? Plate
3) If stamped in a plate, what’s the last patent date? Nov.17, 1903
4) Does straight edge (where front of reproducer carriage rides) have 2 screws? No
5) Does the upper casting have lugs for Class M pulley wheels? No
6) Which secures the endgate; a ball catch, or a locking lug? Ball catch
7) Does carriage hold the reproducer with nickeled clips, or a single screw at 2:00 position? single screw at 2:00
8) Motor number (found stamped on front of motor frame): 31,242
9) Are the motor gears solid or spoked? Solid
10) If there’s a plate below the mandrel, what exactly does it say? N/A
11) Which does the cabinet have; a drawer, a banner decal, or an “Edison” script decal? "Edison" script, Model B style cabinet
12) Are there any dated material with it? Invoices? Packing slips? Writing inside the lid? N/A

[gsphonos]

Hi George,

Mine is the same as the previous post by drboruff--I have a Model A Triumph in new style B case. Must have been using up old parts at the factory when the Model B came out? It has the square crank, etc.

1. 45025
2. plate
3. Nov. 17, 1903
4. no
5. no
6. ball catch
7. single screw at #2 position
8. 31248
9. solid
10. n/a
11. n/a see description above!
12. no

Hope this helps, and look forward to reading your article!!

Mike Sorter

P.S. This machine is available at CAPS tomorrow--so thought I would post now before it is sold (hopefully!!)

[gsphonos]

Wow, I just noticed the close proximity of the serial number and motor number for my Triump and drboruff's triumph......

[MTPhono]

George - I found another Triumph (and a variant):

This has been converted to 2/4 minute gearing
1. 31653
2. plate
3. May 31, 1898
4. no
5. no
6. ball catch
7. single screw at #2 position
8. 18758
9. solid
10. n/a
11. Banner cabinet
12. no

Edison Triumph (Eclipse nameplate) - not certain if you are also looking for coin-op Triumph variants
1. 74456C
2. plate
3. May 22, 1906
4. no
5. no
6. none
7. single screw at #2 position
8. electric motor
9. electric motor
10. n/a
11. Eclipse cabinet
12. no

[phonogfp]

Jerry,
Thanks for your Spring Motor data. You and I have Spring Motor Phonographs numbered only 61 apart! You did the right thing by putting a nickeled clip - style carriage on it. A single screw carriage, although a legitimate improvement, was not the way the machine was originally assembled. Also, is "Van" your correct last name (for my acknowledgements)?

David, Mike,
Thanks for your data on the two transitional Triumphs. There seem to have been at least 1200 of these transitional models built (serials ca. 45000 to ca. 46,200 so far)using the model A mechanisms with the model B cabinets. I'd be interested in learning about A/B Triumphs serially numbered below 45000 and above 46,200.

Scott,
Thanks for your data, which comprises the earliest model A I have so far in the database, and the only model C so far.

You guys are great - - thanks!

George P.

[gsphonos]

George ,

I have 2 spring motor concerts--is this data you would like as well?

Also have a Triumph E that I will report on here

1. 86558 "E" model
2. Stamped plate
3. May 22, 1906
4. No
5. No
6. N/a
7. Single screw #2 position
8. 69508
9. Solid
10. N/A
11. Edison decal
12. No

Didn't think you wanted anything beyond early triumphs, but saw a few others posted here so am including just in case!

Mike Sorter