New 78's Possibilities...

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SteveM
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by SteveM »

The most glorious PMJ song, IMO ... :D

[youtubehd]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyTTX6Wlf1Y[/youtubehd]
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HisMastersVoice
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by HisMastersVoice »

SteveM wrote:The most glorious PMJ song, IMO ... :D

[youtubehd]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyTTX6Wlf1Y[/youtubehd]
How about the same song for 4 Contrabassoons?

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yOfzJHyw3rA[/youtube]

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travisgreyfox
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by travisgreyfox »

Lets go with something untraditional and completely off the wall. DUBSTEP :lol:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gp996_GgISY

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emgcr
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by emgcr »

donniej wrote:This sounds like a good first-draft of a FAQ section :lol:

Q1. You are making new lateral-cut 78s (amongst other types) but from what material ?

The 78's I produce are made of a proprietary polyurethane resin, made to simulate the properties of shellac discs.

Q2. What is the process of manufacture ? "Moulding" is mentioned as opposed to "pressing" ?

Discs are copied using silicone molds. The mold is filled with a measured amount of polyurethane resin (weighed out on a scale) and pressure cast in a heated chamber.

Q3. Can these be played in exactly the same way as traditional 78s ie with thorn, bamboo and steel in addition to diamond etc ?

Yes, up to 85*F, at which point they begin to wear as rapidly as a Victor bat-wing at 90*F. I have no data on thorn needles, steel and bamboo work fine, as well as modern turntables.

Q4. Will your discs last as long as traditional 78s in your estimation ?

Shelf life is indefinite. Wear under a steel needle is approximately comparable to a shellac 78. Discs are tested with 150 grams of force on a soft tone needle, which is the heaviest of common weights placed on discs. A revised formula is good to over 200 grams (for front mount machines).

Q5. Do they sound the same as traditional 78s ?

The copies sound identical to the originals.

Q6. Are they as strong/brittle as traditional 78s or more "plastic" ?

For manufacturing reasons, they're much thicker than a typical 78, making them much stronger. The resin is also less brittle than shellac but they're not flexible. They're generally safe to ship in an envelope but can break if abused.

Q7. How would you describe the extent of surface noise---as quiet as say traditional Australian or French pressings ?

That's complicated. The material is as quiet as a good Victor scroll label but a copy made from a disc with high surface noise (like a Berliner, for example) will carry that over to the copy.

Q8. Are you making 10 inch and 12 inch records ?

For cost reasons, I prefer to make disc 10" and smaller. I can (and do) sometimes make 12" but those are much more complicated and therefore expensive.

Q9. Can you supply double-sided records ?

For cost reasons, all 78's are single sided.

Q10. What is the cost of a disc ?

78's are $20 for 7" or 8" and $25 for 10"

Q11. Can multiple copies be bought at cheaper unit cost ?

Prices are already very low, so while I wouldn't rule it out, it's not likely.

Q12. What is the time frame between receiving an original disc or digital information and sending a new copy ?

Original discs are returned as quickly as possible, typically within one week. Copies then ship a week or two later.
A time frame for cutting a new disc from a digital file has not yet been determined.

Q13. What do you mean by chemical copying ?

Silicone mold making.
Very many thanks for your explicit and most helpful answers. Congratulations for having started this wonderful project which I am sure will be hugely appreciated by a great number of people. I shall definitely be ordering shortly.

Phototone
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by Phototone »

So, why not try to find a vintage record press, have your acetates plated (farm out), have stampers made and start pressing in real shellac? Obvious next step. I'm sure with the upswing in vinyl album production there are various places to have plated masters and stampers made. Yet, nobody is attempting to press in shellac.

donniej
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by donniej »

Phototone wrote:So, why not try to find a vintage record press, have your acetates plated (farm out), have stampers made and start pressing in real shellac? Obvious next step. I'm sure with the upswing in vinyl album production there are various places to have plated masters and stampers made. Yet, nobody is attempting to press in shellac.
I wish it were possible, here's what I previously found...
In order to press shellac a company would need all the pressing equipment they already have, but they'd also need to invest in a Banbury mixer, extruder and roller mill. Not to mention the steam generator to keep it all hot enough to melt the shellac. This equipment could not be powered with household 100 - 200 amp service, let alone have enough space to store even a small Banbury mixer (size of a car). Each of the Banbury mixers in Camden was larger than a typical sized house.

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Curt A
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by Curt A »

Post Modern Jukebox is great... also, maybe this version of "Puttin' On The Ritz"...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OA358YVquP8
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Phototone
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by Phototone »

donniej wrote:
Phototone wrote:So, why not try to find a vintage record press, have your acetates plated (farm out), have stampers made and start pressing in real shellac? Obvious next step. I'm sure with the upswing in vinyl album production there are various places to have plated masters and stampers made. Yet, nobody is attempting to press in shellac.
I wish it were possible, here's what I previously found...
In order to press shellac a company would need all the pressing equipment they already have, but they'd also need to invest in a Banbury mixer, extruder and roller mill. Not to mention the steam generator to keep it all hot enough to melt the shellac. This equipment could not be powered with household 100 - 200 amp service, let alone have enough space to store even a small Banbury mixer (size of a car). Each of the Banbury mixers in Camden was larger than a typical sized house.
I really don't think the small regional labels that proliferated in the 1940's and early 1950's had Banbury mixers. I bet they bought preformed "pucks" of shellac and heated them up on a large hot plate until they were soft enough to put in the press. Of course one still had to have a steam boiler to heat the press.

VanEpsFan1914
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by VanEpsFan1914 »

I have two records by the Empire Jazz Band from 1919, recorded on the Empire Talking Machine label. They are in very nice condition, but are "universal cut" like the Arto record. While they play on a Victrola or similar phonograph, the sound is a little harsh, but these recordings are extremely rare and I hate to damage them.

I will be able to retrieve them from South Carolina over the summer and I would love to send them them for copying, whether in original condition or digitally equalized for lateral playback. (A stereo transfer pickup mayhap?) Folks might really like these. For 1919 they're some serious Dixieland stuff.

Titles are:
The Alcoholic Blues
At the Jazz Band Ball
Lassus Trombone
Missouri Blues.

Very early jazz with a ragtime twang. As if the Marine Band busted up a jazz club. I LIKE 'em and would love to see these rarities re-released.

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audiophile102
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Re: New 78's Possibilities...

Post by audiophile102 »

SteveM wrote:The most glorious PMJ song, IMO ... :D

[youtubehd]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iyTTX6Wlf1Y[/youtubehd]
Kate Davis is wonderful. Thanks for posting this.
"You can't take the phonographs nor the money with you, but the contentment the phonographs bring may well make your life better, and happier lives make the world a better place."

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