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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 4:42 am 
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Victor III
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F. Depero, "Grammofono", 1923.
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 4:19 am
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The two takes by Bonci on Fonotipia can be listened to here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1L_HEh3mQzo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-gt2aPCGxY

Unfortunately the tracks were posted by one of those "anti-hiss magicians" who, for some inexplicable reason, think that oodles of digital artifacts sound better than few natural clicks here and there.


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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 3:18 pm 
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Victor II
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2016 1:49 am
Posts: 305
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Marco Gilardetti wrote:
The two takes by Bonci on Fonotipia can be listened to here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1L_HEh3mQzo
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=b-gt2aPCGxY

Unfortunately the tracks were posted by one of those "anti-hiss magicians" who, for some inexplicable reason, think that oodles of digital artifacts sound better than few natural clicks here and there.


Yes, there are plenty of lousy transfers out there to be wary of. Equally infuriating are those who post early recordings played on vintage equipment improperly miked, and at the wrong speeds. These situations do a tremendous disservice to those who are hearing these recordings for the first time, and not having experienced hearing what they are supposed to sound like, then dismiss them, thereby losing out on a rich, important, educational, and highly enjoyable treasure trove of great (and not-so-great) performances.

Steven


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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 10:15 pm 
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Victor I
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Viva-voce wrote:
There was enough room to include "questa o quella" on the same side lol

Steven


Bonci did precisely that on purple, later blue amberol 29001, one of five recordings he made for (or at least, that were issued by) Edison strictly as cylinders. Girard and Barnes, not always reliable on such points, date them to 1913. Unless I'm much mistaken, those are the sole purple amberol cylinders not dubbed from corresponding disc masters.


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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Mon May 07, 2018 10:41 pm 
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Victor II
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2016 1:49 am
Posts: 305
Location: British Columbia, Canada
drh wrote:
Viva-voce wrote:
There was enough room to include "questa o quella" on the same side lol

Steven


Bonci did precisely that on purple, later blue amberol 29001, one of five recordings he made for (or at least, that were issued by) Edison strictly as cylinders. Girard and Barnes, not always reliable on such points, date them to 1913. Unless I'm much mistaken, those are the sole purple amberol cylinders not dubbed from corresponding disc masters.


Haha he did? I didn't know that---would be very interesting to hear it.
Thanks for this info :)

Steven


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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2018 3:09 am 
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Victor VI
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Edison Records - Close your eyes and see if the artist does not actually seem to be before you.
Joined: Sat Jan 10, 2009 4:28 pm
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Location: Česká Republika
Viva-voce wrote:
drh wrote:
Viva-voce wrote:
There was enough room to include "questa o quella" on the same side lol

Steven


Bonci did precisely that on purple, later blue amberol 29001, one of five recordings he made for (or at least, that were issued by) Edison strictly as cylinders. Girard and Barnes, not always reliable on such points, date them to 1913. Unless I'm much mistaken, those are the sole purple amberol cylinders not dubbed from corresponding disc masters.


Haha he did? I didn't know that---would be very interesting to hear it.
Thanks for this info :)

Steven


Your wish is my command! Not my video although I do have the cylinder too.

(Double-click the video above or click this link to watch the video on YouTube in HD.)



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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2018 4:11 am 
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Victor III
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F. Depero, "Grammofono", 1923.
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 4:19 am
Posts: 704
Location: Italy
Viva-voce wrote:
Yes, there are plenty of lousy transfers out there to be wary of. Equally infuriating are those who post early recordings played on vintage equipment improperly miked, and at the wrong speeds. These situations do a tremendous disservice to those who are hearing these recordings for the first time, and not having experienced hearing what they are supposed to sound like, then dismiss them, thereby losing out on a rich, important, educational, and highly enjoyable treasure trove of great (and not-so-great) performances.

While I agree with your comments in general, it's still private people we're talking about, possibly without any musical education, and posting videos on their free time. But what about those CDs in which 78s operatic arias are dubbed at the most unlikely speed and pitch? And shouldn't we mention silent movies dubbed on DVDs at ridicolous frame per second ratios, as if every silent film was a Three Stooges' sketch?


Last edited by Marco Gilardetti on Tue May 08, 2018 7:28 am, edited 1 time in total.

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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2018 4:58 am 
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Victor II
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2016 1:49 am
Posts: 305
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Marco Gilardetti wrote:
Viva-voce wrote:
Yes, there are plenty of lousy transfers out there to be wary of. Equally infuriating are those who post early recordings played on vintage equipment improperly miked, and at the wrong speeds. These situations do a tremendous disservice to those who are hearing these recordings for the first time, and not having experienced hearing what they are supposed to sound like, then dismiss them, thereby losing out on a rich, important, educational, and highly enjoyable treasure trove of great (and not-so-great) performances.

While I agree with your comments in general, it's still private people we're talking about, possibly without any muscial education, and posting videos on their free time. But what about those CDs in which 78s operatic arias are dubbed at the most unlikely speed and pitch? And shouldn't we mention silent movies dubbed on DVDs at ridicolous frame per second ratios, as if every silent film was a Three Stooges' sketch?


Yes you are absolutely correct--and lousy "professional" transfers have been foisted on the public for decades---since the dawn of the Lp era--and even way before that lol


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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2018 5:07 am 
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Victor II
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2016 1:49 am
Posts: 305
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Aw thanks Valecnik :)


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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2018 8:00 pm 
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Victor I
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 12:24 pm
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Viva-voce wrote:
Yes you are absolutely correct--and lousy "professional" transfers have been foisted on the public for decades---since the dawn of the Lp era--and even way before that lol


Indeed, if I may be so bold, LP transfers of 78s were uniformly, if not entirely, awful. The best of them were bad, bad, bad. That's why I started collecting originals, as an early teen, in the 1970s: even then, with no "audiophile" training whatsoever, I could tell that I got better sound from them than from any LP transfer that I heard. Some CD issues are quite listenable; we've come a long way since then. But LP transfers? Ugh.

In more recent years, for a while I lamented that I never bought a Packburn when they were available, although the $$$ asked for them had quite legitimately kept them out of my reach at the time. Then, one happy day, it came to me: the Packburns and their ilk were the tools responsible for all those awful LP transfers I hated back then. Why would I want one when even the most modest current computer software, like "Click Repair," runs rings around what they yielded? Contentment is a lovely thing! :D


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 Post subject: Re: RIGOLETTO, La Donna è Mobile, Alessandro Bonci on Ediso
PostPosted: Tue May 08, 2018 8:48 pm 
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Victor V
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ClickRepair isn't really set up for convenient real time listening however. I guess you could integrate a PC running CR within your hi-fi set up if you wanted. Packburn is 1970's analog technology and now there is options like the SugarCube - http://www.sweetvinyl.com - but it's $ 2000.00.

In the classical / opera realm some of the 78 to LP transfers on Pearl were passable, but a mixed bag. EMI did some okay stuff later on that can be found on LP. I completely gave up bothering with LP's of 78's some years ago. The CD era has seen some bad sounding stuff still come out, but generally standards have improved, and there are high quality boutique labels like Marston that still push the envelope.


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