An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Share your phonograph repair & restoration techniques here
User avatar
Roaring20s
Victor V
Posts: 2550
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:55 am
Personal Text: Those who were seen dancing were thought insane by those who could not hear the music. Nietzsche
Location: Tucson, AZ

An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by Roaring20s »

The less mechanically inclined may find this helpful, before thinking a larger problem is brewing.

I have been playing many cylinders lately and do oil all the moving parts. Or so I thought. :oops:

Symptom
Over the past weeks, I began to hear increased "motor" noise while in the 4 minute mode. The sound was not heard in the 2 minute mode.

Affect
Today, while midway through a record the noise increased a bit and the machine began to slow to a stop. I was wound about half way and feared a catastrophic event loomed.

While assessing the situation a decided to see if the 2 minute mode worked. It did, but was slower. I started to let the machine unwind, and as it did, wondered, and had an "Ah ha!" moment. I wiggled the endgate.

Cause
The point of connection between the mandrel and the endgate needed lubrication. Overlooked, it choked up!

Speculation
There must be a bit more drag in the 4 minute mode? :coffee:

I am very happy that is all it turned out to be.
Also, the increased "motor" noise is completely gone! :D

James.
Screen Shot 2019-04-06 at 10.27.03 PM.png

edisonplayer
Victor IV
Posts: 1559
Joined: Mon Mar 04, 2013 3:33 pm

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by edisonplayer »

My late friend Arthur Pare told me about this.edisonplayer

Jerry B.
Victor Monarch Special
Posts: 8511
Joined: Tue Feb 10, 2009 11:25 am
Personal Text: Stop for a visit when in Oregon.
Location: Albany, Oregon

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by Jerry B. »

Good point. Thanks for the reminder. Jerry B.

Phonofreak
Victor VI
Posts: 3718
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 7:00 pm
Location: Western, WA State

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by Phonofreak »

I use regular oil for the endgate, like everything else on the phonograph.
Harvey Kravitz

JerryVan
Victor Monarch Special
Posts: 5282
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:08 pm
Location: Southeast MI

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by JerryVan »

It also doesn't hurt a bit to wet the end of your finger with oil and wipe it across the edge of the carriage support. (You know, where the front of the carriage slides. Can't think of a better name for it now.) Really reduces drag on the lead screw, especially if the horn is supported only by the carriage.

Phonofreak
Victor VI
Posts: 3718
Joined: Tue Mar 23, 2010 7:00 pm
Location: Western, WA State

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by Phonofreak »

Good important point. The part is called the knife edge.
Harvey Kravitz
JerryVan wrote:It also doesn't hurt a bit to wet the end of your finger with oil and wipe it across the edge of the carriage support. (You know, where the front of the carriage slides. Can't think of a better name for it now.) Really reduces drag on the lead screw, especially if the horn is supported only by the carriage.

User avatar
Chuck
Victor III
Posts: 891
Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2011 11:28 pm
Personal Text: Richards Laboratories http://www.richardslaboratories.com producing high quality cylinder blanks
Contact:

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by Chuck »

A small oilcan full of 20W50 motor oil is
kept near the model D machine.

A few drops here and there very regularly keep it
running smoothly and quietly.

The knife edge does get dry and does need a couple
drops of oil put on and wiped across with a finger.

And, as I have expressed here many times before,
I personally think that weighing down the carriage
arm with an unsupported horn of any kind is a rather
bad idea. It just loads down the whole carriage.
Not good. Much better to take the weight off of
the carriage by using a larger horn that hangs from a crane and have the carriage connected to it using
a rubber hose.

Hanging an overhung weight on a cylinder machine
carriage has always been a bad idea. It wears
the guides.
"Sustained success depends on searching
for, and gaining, fundamental understanding"

-Bell System Credo

JerryVan
Victor Monarch Special
Posts: 5282
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:08 pm
Location: Southeast MI

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by JerryVan »

Phonofreak wrote:Good important point. The part is called the knife edge.
Harvey Kravitz

... and I knew that, right up until the time I wanted to type it. :roll:

Menophanes
Victor II
Posts: 429
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:52 am
Location: Redruth, Cornwall, U.K.

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by Menophanes »

JerryVan wrote:It also doesn't hurt a bit to wet the end of your finger with oil and wipe it across the edge of the carriage support. (You know, where the front of the carriage slides. Can't think of a better name for it now.) Really reduces drag on the lead screw, especially if the horn is supported only by the carriage.
I made the same discovery when salvaging ('restoring' is too lofty a term for the little I did) a long-disused Model B Home. The motor seemed to run well, I had cleaned the surface rust from the straight-edge and the carrier-arm appeared to move freely, but as soon as I lowered the reproducer the speed went down. A film of oil on the straight-edge cured the problem at once.

In James's photograph, I am puzzled by the device which has been inserted between the reproducer (apparently a normal C, H or possibly K) and the horn; it looks like a second reproducer, or at least a second diaphragm contained in a shallow body. What is this?

Oliver Mundy.

User avatar
alang
VTLA
Posts: 3109
Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:36 am
Personal Text: TMF Moderator
Location: Delaware

Re: An overlooked point for lubrication on Edison Standard

Post by alang »

Menophanes wrote: In James's photograph, I am puzzled by the device which has been inserted between the reproducer (apparently a normal C, H or possibly K) and the horn; it looks like a second reproducer, or at least a second diaphragm contained in a shallow body. What is this?

Oliver Mundy.
I believe that's an after market volume control.

Andreas

Post Reply