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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Mon Mar 26, 2012 9:34 pm 
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Victor O
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Edison Phonographs
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:45 am
Posts: 63
My dog just chewed up one of my blue amberols. Need for worry?
revive all kinds of edison cylinder phonographs and roller organs


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:06 am 
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Victor O
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Mankind has far passed the day that the day was met in wonderment and not expectation
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:51 pm
Posts: 88
Location: West Virginia
since asbestos is a fiberous substance and was abundant back then, I can see that it may have been used as a filler in some brands of cylinders. If it was used, it probably had nothing to do with its heat resistance and more for its fiberous qualities to strengthen the plaster.

If one wanted to cheaply test for it's presence perhaps all one needs to do is heat a chunk of the plaster in a fire until the plaster is soluable in water again, then soak it and turn it to a mush, carefully strain and look for the asbestos fibers in the mush since the asbestos wouldn't have burnt up. A microscope would probably be needed depending on the length of the fibers.

Also, when one breaks a suspect cylinder, if it has asbestos fibers in it it may have what looks like hairs protruding from the break or it may fracture but not come apart due to the fibers.

Just because one type of cylinder from one period of production didn't have it would not mean that all cylinders from different manufacturers at all periods is free of asbestos though.


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 9:24 am 
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Victor O
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Edison Phonographs
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:45 am
Posts: 63
I will let you all know if she keels over any time soon. :) I don't know what she has for these things. I should have taken a photo, it was mutilated.
revive all kinds of edison cylinder phonographs and roller organs


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Tue Mar 27, 2012 3:43 pm 
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Victor IV
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A new blank with authentic formula and spiral core!
Joined: Wed Oct 21, 2009 10:50 am
Posts: 1338
Location: 615 1/2 South Main Street Princeton IL 61356.
The components of Amberol wax is toxic as well. Pre 1908 Gold Molded records do not contain lead, but post 1908 ones do.

contains

Asphalt
Lead
Sterate
Resin gum
Litharge (lead oxide)


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:40 pm 
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Victor IV
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Joined: Thu Jul 14, 2011 12:09 pm
Posts: 1649
EdisonPhonographGuy wrote:
I will let you all know if she keels over any time soon. :) I don't know what she has for these things. I should have taken a photo, it was mutilated.

True story -- A friend of mine years ago had a Norwegian Elkhound that one day acquired a taste for Edison 2M wax cylinders. He chewed the box into shredded pieces and nothing remained of the cylinder but a million little shards. The title of that delicacy? "The Whistler and His Dog"!!! The dog had a good taste for music.


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Wed Mar 28, 2012 2:46 pm 
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Victor O
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Edison Phonographs
Joined: Sun Mar 25, 2012 10:45 am
Posts: 63
I don't know what it was that drove her to it. It was in a box of several cylinders and many other things to chew up, shoes, reproducers, several boxes. Doesn't look like she swallowed anything, but just left a million little pieces. When I walked in, I didn't need to say anyhthing. It was that priceless look....
revive all kinds of edison cylinder phonographs and roller organs


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Thu Mar 29, 2012 3:15 pm 
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Victor O
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Mankind has far passed the day that the day was met in wonderment and not expectation
Joined: Sun Mar 11, 2012 7:51 pm
Posts: 88
Location: West Virginia
Even if asbestos was in the cylinder your dog ate I don't imagine it would hurt it. The asbestos fibers are bad to lungs because they embed and cut them up. The digestive tract is more hardy of an organ and should, maybe after a vet approved laxative, move all the material out. I don't think that asbestos is toxic chemically though.

Look on the bright side, if there was asbestos in it, now your dog can eat taco bell food leftovers without harm of breathing fire for a while. Just kidding, I hope the dog comes out fine.


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Sat Mar 31, 2012 10:46 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Sat Feb 20, 2010 8:02 pm
Posts: 805
Location: Melbourne, FL
Asbestos is totally inert (harmless) if ingested or taken internally. It only poses a risk when you breathe it in. Lead is only a risk if you ingest it, If you just handle it from time to time, There is no risk. Just don't eat the lead! Lead acts like Mercury when you eat it, It will make you crazy, literally! When eaten, It causes Brain damage and Blood poisoning. That is why they have all those Lead Paint warnings so little kids don't eat the paint. It is also not good if it makes it into your bloodstream, but that it really far remote.

Tony K.
Melbourne, FL.


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 5:52 am 
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Victor O
Joined: Thu May 19, 2011 11:05 am
Posts: 55
Although this thread got forgotten, the situation is still the same: We don't know if Asbestos is in Blue Amberol cylinders, and if collectors ream those without knowing, they are in huge danger to get lung cancer.

This is no fun. We should take this problem serious and I am ready to spend some money to know what are the facts. Anybody out there who wants to collaborate on this with me?

Thanks, Helmut


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 Post subject: Re: ASBESTOS in Edison Blue Amberol's plaster core ?
PostPosted: Tue Feb 12, 2013 12:09 pm 
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Victor V
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Joined: Thu Aug 19, 2010 9:36 am
Posts: 2188
Location: Delaware
Interestingly enough, the same issue has recently been discussed at the German forum as well. Our member Starkton inquired with experts at his museum and was told a simple method for determining if Asbestos is present. "separate the supect fibers and then apply heat until they glow. If they survive it's Asbestos, if they burn then not." I suppose one could grind some of the core of a blue amberol and sift it through a fine screen to separate the gipsum powder from fibers if present. Then use a blow torch on the fibers. Of course one should wear proper protective gear like face mask, gloves, etc. Should not be more dangerous than actually reaming a cylinder.
Andreas


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