The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

It is currently Mon Sep 24, 2018 7:15 pm

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
 Post subject: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 1:54 pm 
Offline
Victor III
User avatar
music is time travel and strings moments in time together like nothing else I know -- Kathleen Lane
Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:23 am
Posts: 801
Location: North Oregon Coast
I made a recording and video of a Pathé Actuelle needle cut record this morning and I have some questions about how these records were made. It is very noisy and I would even say poor quality. The record is in near mint condition and there are not flaws visually on the record. But, it has a lot of rumble throughout and there are some very obvious low frequency thumps in various places of the record. Both sides have this same issue. This is not the type of thing I have encountered on worn records. I am quite sure the sound came from the manufacturing process.

I am assuming that Acutelle recordings that also came out on vertical cut records (as did this one) were made using some version of the Pantograph method by Pathé. While I have always thought Pathé records in general were pretty noisy, this seems worse than vertical cut record. Am I imagining this or is it a common problem with Pathé's needle cut records?

(Double-click the video above or click this link to watch the video on YouTube in HD.)


https://youtu.be/7n4b6I3dBuU
-- Dan

Visit My YouTube Channel
Visit the OTAPS Home Page http://otaps.org


Last edited by melvind on Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:00 pm 
Offline
Victor V
User avatar
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 2:33 pm
Posts: 2530
Location: Near NY's Capital
melvind wrote:
I am assuming that Acutelle recordings that also came out on vertical cut records (as did this one) were made using some version of the Pantograph method by Pathé. While I have always thought Pathé records in general were pretty noisy, this seems worse than vertical cut record. Am I imagining this or is it a common problem with Pathé's needle cut records.


The answer is yes to all of this. Actuelles are dubbed from the pantograph system just like verticals were, so are some Perfect discs if you didn't know. Quality varies for sure. Those thumps and bumps you hear can be downright violent sounding. Yet at the same time, some of these dubs are great. Quality control doesn't seem like it was much of a concern!

Sean


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:30 pm 
Offline
Victor V
User avatar
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:52 pm
Posts: 2118
Pretty normal Pathé stuff. Trying high pass filtering that junk out. Ward Marston's transfer of this record has those low frequency noises pretty much totally absent. Marston is often the gold standard with this stuff.


Last edited by Wolfe on Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:33 pm 
Offline
Victor III
User avatar
music is time travel and strings moments in time together like nothing else I know -- Kathleen Lane
Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:23 am
Posts: 801
Location: North Oregon Coast
Wolfe wrote:
Pretty normal Pathé stuff. Trying high pass filtering that junk out. Ward Marston's transfer of this record has those low frequency noises pretty much totally absent, while still sounding pretty similar to your transfer. He has the pitch a little higher, too. Marston is often the gold standard with this stuff.


I wonder if Marton's came from the vertical cut record rather than the needle cut record. It could be a much clearer copy. But, I don't really know.
-- Dan

Visit My YouTube Channel
Visit the OTAPS Home Page http://otaps.org


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 2:39 pm 
Offline
Victor V
User avatar
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:52 pm
Posts: 2118
Good point, he lists his copy that he used as catalog # 54036, which should be a vertically cut disc. It would have still been dubbed from a master cylinder, but perhaps the set up for that transfered less noise than the lateral.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 3:20 pm 
Offline
Victor V
User avatar
Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 2:33 pm
Posts: 2530
Location: Near NY's Capital
Also, I don't think these dubs were done at the same time, so conditions could have been very different each time a dub was done. I find verticals to be much less loaded with those noises, but again, there isn't ever a lot of consistency.

Sean


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 7:34 pm 
Offline
Victor V
User avatar
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:52 pm
Posts: 2118
^ That's another point. That recording was made in 1918 and (presumably) put out on the hill and dale disc around the same time, but the needle cut Pathés weren't introduced until 1920 or so.


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:31 pm 
Offline
Victor V
User avatar
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 7:52 pm
Posts: 2118
Just as curio that might fit here - 20 seconds into this film is a clip of Claudia Muzio recording a cylinder master for Pathé.

https://youtu.be/Pn1r2-t59gA


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 11:37 pm 
Offline
Victor III
User avatar
music is time travel and strings moments in time together like nothing else I know -- Kathleen Lane
Joined: Sun Mar 08, 2009 1:23 am
Posts: 801
Location: North Oregon Coast
Wolfe wrote:
Just as curio that might fit here - 20 seconds into this film is a clip of Claudia Muzio recording a cylinder master for Pathé.


Wonderful find! Thanks for posting it.
-- Dan

Visit My YouTube Channel
Visit the OTAPS Home Page http://otaps.org


Top
 Profile  
 
 Post subject: Re: Pathé Actuelle Claudia Muzio record and a question
PostPosted: Fri Mar 09, 2018 12:34 am 
Offline
Victor II
Joined: Fri Jul 08, 2016 1:49 am
Posts: 361
Location: British Columbia, Canada
Yes I send my thanks also for posting this. I really enjoyed it along with the YouTube posts of Ponselle simulating a recording at the horn for the cameras as well as the similar 1924 footage of Galli-Curci in the studio filmed by British Pathé :)

Steven


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 13 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 5 hours [ DST ]


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 0 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB © 2000, 2002, 2005, 2007 phpBB Group
Americanized by Maël Soucaze.