A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor records

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CharliePhono
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A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor records

Post by CharliePhono »

Over the years, I have come to notice a noise phenomenon that occurs at the beginning of some Victor acoustic recordings. It is somewhat difficult to describe, but is akin to a metallic "puff" or a muted clunk just before the selection begins. I have heard this only on some, but certainly not all, Victor acoustics. It seems confined to the earlier discs, i.e., pre-1920s. Does anyone know what this is? Was it some sort of signal from the recording engineer to begin the music/performance? I find it hard to believe that, as when Rosa Ponselle described an acoustic recording session, she stated the engineer simply gave a signal at which point the conductor would raise the baton to begin recording. Anyone else noticed this or am I just hearing things?
Last edited by CharliePhono on Sat Mar 02, 2019 1:37 pm, edited 1 time in total.

estott
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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by estott »

You are not mistaken- it is not unusual to hear a conductor's signal on records.

and on this you can hear the whistle from a nearby factory[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0GQ8EnkDpY[/youtube]

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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by CharliePhono »

estott wrote:You are not mistaken- it is not unusual to hear a conductor's signal on records.

and on this you can hear the whistle from a nearby factory[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0GQ8EnkDpY[/youtube]
Thank you for that. I love Galli-Curci, and that particular recording I had not heard. It is a lovely song, and aside from the intrusive whistle, is a beautiful recording.

Charlie

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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by Henry »

estott wrote:You are not mistaken- it is not unusual to hear a conductor's signal on records.

and on this you can hear the whistle from a nearby factory[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z0GQ8EnkDpY[/youtube]
Are you referring to the sustained "a" at approx. 1:45-1:50, and again at 2:45-end?

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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by Wolfe »

On the earlier records there is sometimes a rapping sound, or a couple of raps. I've assumed that was the conductor signalling the start.

Rosa Ponselle didn't start recording for Victor until 1923, late in the acoustic era, so maybe they had changed the practice. Rosario Bourdon conducted her Victor acoustics.

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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by CharliePhono »

Wolfe wrote:On the earlier records there is sometimes a rapping sound, or a couple of raps. I've assumed that was the conductor signalling the start.

Rosa Ponselle didn't start recording for Victor until 1923, late in the acoustic era, so maybe they had changed the practice. Rosario Bourdon conducted her Victor acoustics.
Wolfe, I believe that is precisely what I am hearing - a light rapping noise. As well, I failed to mention that Mlle Ponselle was discussing her acoustic recording experiences for Columbia: https://78records.wordpress.com/2018/05 ... ecordings/
Last edited by CharliePhono on Sat Mar 02, 2019 9:24 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by Wolfe »

Yes, I don't recall hearing it on a Columbia record, if I have.

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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by Zkeener323 »

I believe I hear it at about the thirty eight second mark. I wish I could recall what records they were but I have two in my collection where there are these strange sounds. One has a clunking sound at the begininning andf the other occurs further in right before the vocal. I always just assumed it was someone messing with the recording horn. However, a conductor tap or recording engineer signal sound much more probable than my assumption.

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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by Wolfe »

Zkeener323 wrote:I believe I hear it at about the thirty eight second mark. I wish I could recall what records they were but I have two in my collection where there are these strange sounds. One has a clunking sound at the begininning andf the other occurs further in right before the vocal. I always just assumed it was someone messing with the recording horn. However, a conductor tap or recording engineer signal sound much more probable than my assumption.
Not exactly somebody messing with the horn, but a bump into the horn. This has several, like at 1:16:

[youtube]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fXKr-wcFplg[/youtube]

The same bumps are on any transfer or copy of this 78 that I've heard, I have a few copies of this.

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Re: A mysterious sound at the beginning of some Victor recor

Post by estott »

Henry wrote:
estott wrote:You are not mistaken- it is not unusual to hear a conductor's signal on records.

and on this you can hear the whistle from a nearby factory

Are you referring to the sustained "a" at approx. 1:45-1:50, and again at 2:45-end?

No, I mean it- the Campbells Soup plant was near the studio, start at .33 and you can hear the factory whistle- she pauses a second & it is audible over the strings. It can be heard on other records too & the Sooy Brothers write of it in their memoirs.

Similarly the Vitaphone movie studios were located in a Brooklyn basement & sometimes picked up the subway noises

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