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 Post subject: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 3:29 pm 
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Victor I
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I recently came across a HMV 101 for sale with an added electric pickup. Anyone knowing something about such add ons?
Update: I don't know the nationality of this HMV, I have not talked to the owner. More photos are now added.
Would you as a collector of acoustic HMVs consider this gramophone collectible? It also has an additional HMV no 4 soundbox following it.


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Last edited by nostalgia on Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:19 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 4:16 pm 
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Victor II
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This has not only an electrical pickup, but also a different brake system. I make a guess... It's it a German machine?

Please, more photos!

The electrical pickups were intended to be connected to the phono input of a tube radio. Usually they have an intermediate volume control. If when connecting there is a hum, then the two connectors must be swapped, and connect in the opposite position.

These electrical pickups have internal delicate bobines, and a metal armature connected to the needle Chuck, and the month of the armature by the record grooves the element which changes the electromagnetic field between the poles. The metal parts are damped with rubber parts. These usually have to be renewed, of they are hardened with age. Also there is usually a permanent magnet which provides the strong magnetic field. The metal armature vibrations produce changes in the magnetic flux, and these changes are the primary source of electric power in the bobines terminals, the electric signal being a copy of the vibrating needle. These permanent magnets may have lost its magnetism with age. The way to re-magnetise them may be through electricity (resting into a powerful stable magnetic field produced by an induction bobine) or adding a new magnet to them. These modern neodymium magnets today available produce an intense field with very small size. If there's place into the pickup case to fix one of these magnets to the old one, this might cure the problem. Ask Norman Field, who knows a lot about these pickups. Search on the web and ask him. don't know if he is in this forum...
Inigo


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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Wed Jul 10, 2019 5:21 pm 
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Victor I
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More photos added, and also a small update added in my previous post.


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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 3:57 am 
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Victor V
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I think the unusual brake mechanism was supplied with the electrical pickup, to enable the motor to be stopped electrically. I have a similar mechanism on a Paillard portable, which stops the motor abruptly and makes me worry about possibly breaking the governor springs. I very rarely use it.

If this is a German Electrola, the soundbox should be an Electrola No.4a.

The case appears to be green, making the machine more desirable than the bog standard black version.


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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 4:22 am 
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Victor I
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Three additional photos, showing the HMV soundbox also following the gramophone, and part of lid cover, plus case, showing it is a genuine green HMV 101. The asking price is 250 euro, I am not sure if the added electric pickup is defending that price?


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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 5:28 am 
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Victor III
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Location: United Kingdom
The automatic brake is a later addition to a standard green 101. It stops the turntable mechanically, not electrically, as there is no electrical supply to it. It is missing the little round leather pad that fits in the circular bit of the brake, and hits the turntable when the brake is activated. With regards to the electric pick-up, they are rarely in working condition, and are now of little practical use, unless you have a vintage valve radio to use in conjunction with the gramophone, so are of curiosity value only.


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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 7:53 am 
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Victor O
Joined: Sat Oct 13, 2018 7:59 am
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This is one of the early green 101s (1929), probably a V101G to give it its full designation (V=green). The pick up is a later addition, and not of much use now, as Phono 48 says. As long as no holes for wires have been drilled in the case, it can be ditched without damage to the machine,and the correct No 4 soundbox replaced. The auto-stop is also an addition; later 101s had an auto stop, quite different from this. I would be inclined to remove it; the screw holes where it is attached can be plugged, and disguised with tiny tabs of green leathercloth, which can be obtained from folded over bits, e.g. under the motor board.


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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 8:24 am 
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Victor Monarch
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Phono48 wrote:
The automatic brake is a later addition to a standard green 101. It stops the turntable mechanically, not electrically, as there is no electrical supply to it. It is missing the little round leather pad that fits in the circular bit of the brake, and hits the turntable when the brake is activated. With regards to the electric pick-up, they are rarely in working condition, and are now of little practical use, unless you have a vintage valve radio to use in conjunction with the gramophone, so are of curiosity value only.


Norman Field has quite a bit about these devices on his site. He demonstrates an HMV version (played through his computer) and while the sound quality is very good it is not exceptional- and it causes greater record wear than an acoustic soundbox.

I have Parlophone portable with a GRAWOR pick up whicj must be factory fitted- there is a fitting in the case which the cables plug into, with a volume control which plugs into the outer side. A very neat appearance.


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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:35 am 
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Victor III
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estott wrote:
Norman Field has quite a bit about these devices on his site. He demonstrates an HMV version (played through his computer) and while the sound quality is very good it is not exceptional- and it causes greater record wear than an acoustic soundbox.

That's my impression too. On the other hand at least some of them work well with thorn needles. I've sold thorns to people who use them with early electric pickups and they've been pleased with the results. Of course, the suspension/damping would need to be rebuilt and nicely compliant.

I really enjoy Norman's articles and especially his videos on YouTube!
BCN thorn needles made to the original 1920s specifications
www.burmesecolourneedles.com


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 Post subject: Re: HMV 101 with electric pickup
PostPosted: Sat Jul 13, 2019 3:04 pm 
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Victor I
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Thanks for all inputs concerning electric pickups. I am passing this gramophone, but still this was very valuable and interesting information.


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