Vertical-horned EMG.

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emgcr
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Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by emgcr »

Here is a glorious and very rare sight---indeed unique, as far as is known.

The base unit is Mk IX and horn Mk Xb configuration as far as the 29 ½ inch final bell diameter is concerned. The length of the bell from the final part of the internal casting to horn rim is 35 inches which is identical to the same measurement inside a standard Mk Xb horn. This would suggest use of a standard mould in manufacture but one or both of the castings are not, of course, identical. Measurements are currently under way to try to establish exact profiles but, at present, it is thought that the overall length of the horn is somewhat shorter than the standard Xb.

The first photo shows the string attachment to the "plug" (a mute from a musical instrument) which protects the lower part of the horn from ingesting foreign bodies/dust etc !

As expected, the sound is first class and has a special character after being diffused over the ceiling.

The condition of the horn is amazingly good, given that it is probably more than 80 years old and the visual impression is stunning. It is also of a very practical design in terms of footprint and efficient use of vertical space. The light/bright colours greatly add to the overall cosmetic appeal and it is a real wonder that they have not faded/degraded over the years.

It is impossible to guess at the original thinking behind this masterpiece except to imagine a wonderfully eccentric gramophile progressing audio ideas in a creative lateral thinking way. Such notions are likely to have been of an expensive nature ! It would seem logical to assume that the commissioning of the horn might have been as a separate item to accompany an existing Mk IX base since a factory planned gramophone would probably have involved a Mk X base unit for better balance ? We shall probably never know the full intriguing story.

More later................
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by Orchorsol »

Many thanks for photographing, measuring, writing and posting Graham!

It was incredible to meet this bizarre variant in the flesh, and the sound was indeed fantastic as you say, with the immediate reflection and dispersal from the ceiling - much more like the familiar EMG delivery than I was expecting (I'd imagined that listening off-axis/off-beam in this way would diminish the acoustic performance in various ways). The holographic presence perceived inside and projecting from the bell of conventional EMGs wasn't there in the same way of course, but the lifelike tonal qualities were there in abundance, and the listening experience was wonderful.
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by epigramophone »

According to an article by Frank James in the Summer 2006 CLPGS magazine (For the Record No.18) this machine turned up in Kent in 2005, causing Frank (and the rest of us) to wonder what other oddities might still be out there waiting to be discovered.

One obvious disadvantage of the vertical horn is that, unless the room has a very high ceiling, the base unit needs to be on or near the floor. Not ideal for an elderly owner!

Roger.

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by tinovanderzwan »

epigramophone wrote:According to an article by Frank James in the Summer 2006 CLPGS magazine (For the Record No.18) this machine turned up in Kent in 2005, causing Frank (and the rest of us) to wonder what other oddities might still be out there waiting to be discovered.

One obvious disadvantage of the vertical horn is that, unless the room has a very high ceiling, the base unit needs to be on or near the floor. Not ideal for an elderly owner!

Roger.


the positive point is that by triangulating by using the corner of the room you make the amp of the horn even bigger because the corner of the room acts like a extension of the horn just like in most portables the lid acts like a extension of the horn

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by emgcr »

Yes indeed, that is quite correct and placing any horned gramophone in different positions can often substantially alter the sound that the listener will hear. It can be great fun pointing a horn into a corner or an adjacent wall and hearing the sound emerge from yet another place altogether. Reflected sound from ceilings is also an important part of the whole---too high and some of the output is lost---too low and the impact may be oppressive. The larger the horn, the more important these considerations become in my experience.

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by Orchorsol »

emgcr wrote:Yes indeed, that is quite correct and placing any horned gramophone in different positions can often substantially alter the sound that the listener will hear. It can be great fun pointing a horn into a corner or an adjacent wall and hearing the sound emerge from yet another place altogether. Reflected sound from ceilings is also an important part of the whole---too high and some of the output is lost---too low and the impact may be oppressive. The larger the horn, the more important these considerations become in my experience.
Very much the case with this monster, we conjectured, in its original location. http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... 11&t=14931
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by estott »

emgcr wrote:Yes indeed, that is quite correct and placing any horned gramophone in different positions can often substantially alter the sound that the listener will hear. It can be great fun pointing a horn into a corner or an adjacent wall and hearing the sound emerge from yet another place altogether. Reflected sound from ceilings is also an important part of the whole---too high and some of the output is lost---too low and the impact may be oppressive. The larger the horn, the more important these considerations become in my experience.
I've had similar results with my cheap Parlophon horn machine, pointing the horn at a glassed picture on an adjacent wall has excellent reflective results

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by Steve »

Yes, it's certainly a weird curiosity but not my cup of tea to be honest. Does anyone think they simply might have neglected to build the bend in the horn and simply attached a bell to the cast elbow? Admittedly, it's more of a Wilson horn profile and the diameter of the horn is narrower than a 10B would be at that point to allow connection to the elbow but there are some unusual variants out there, definitely

I agree that pointing a large EMG / Expert horn into a facing (and preferably diagonal) corner of the room does give the effect that the sound is really coming from that particular corner. When I tried this and stood in the middle of the room I could not actually "hear" any sound coming from the horn at all - at least my ears were confused sufficiently to muddle what my brain was telling me anyway!

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by chunnybh »

Perhaps not as strange as it looks. In a small room it does look odd but say in an average Scottish tenement with 11.5' ceilings it would look and sound wonderful.
It could also have been an early experiment with reflex sound. EMG certainly went that way with their Davey Corner Reflector speaker cabinets. Infact I have not seen a regular forward facing EMG speaker cabinet apart from the baffle design. Expert speakers on the other hand went straight up, some with reflector panels and some with reflector cones. The very late Expert speakers (I haven't seen one of these yet) started copying more of a Lowther Voigt design with bass chambers and speakers mounted at the bottom, the sound traveling through chambers and then reflected out to the ceiling through a large opening.
Positioning speakers and these large horn beasts is quite a fun challenge. More difficult with a horn than with a set of stereo speakers.

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by Edisone »

Steve wrote:Yes, it's certainly a weird curiosity but not my cup of tea to be honest. Does anyone think they simply might have neglected to build the bend in the horn and simply attached a bell to the cast elbow?
Perhaps a badly damaged "elbow" section was cut out & the remaining pieces were spliced together. I swear I see an angle a few inches above the small end of this horn - it appears to be pointing to the right, then abruptly turns left (very slightly)
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