Vertical-horned EMG.

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emgcr
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by emgcr »

This is an interesting debate and perhaps the only way to start to work out what has been designed/intended or what may have been altered is to take careful measurements of this horn and compare them with those of a standard Xb horn---both having a final outlet diameter of 29 ½ inches. This work is currently being done and will be reported here soon.

In the meantime, here is a rather wonderful photo taken by the owner looking down into the abyss from the rim. Big Brother is definitely upon us.............A great piece of "stand alone" art.
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emgcr
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by emgcr »

Careful measurements have now been taken and the first part of the horn up to the top of the “knuckle” is identical to the Xb (average centreline length 24 inches) and was thus almost certainly made from the same standard pattern. The only slight query is if the angles were to be different but that is probably unlikely as it costs much to make new patterns ! Also, the top and bottom diameters tally in every way with the measurements taken from the Xb.

So the main difference is in the length of the upper part of the horn where the Xb centreline length is 58 ½ inches compared to the vertical horn at 34 ½ inches. The Xb, therefore, is exactly 24 inches longer. Curious indeed that this is the same measurement as the lower section of the horn.

A particularly interesting fact is that, at 58 ½ inches, the total vertical horn centreline length is identical to the total centreline length of the whole upper section on the Xb ! This surely cannot be a coincidence and suggests that EMG planned it that way.

The final piece of serendipity is that the total centreline length of the vertical horn at 58 ½ inches is found to be identical to the centreline length of the EMG Mk IX horn but the Mk IX final bell diameter is 22 inches not 29 ½ inches.

The rate of flare, therefore, on the upper section of the vertical horn is greater than on the Xb, having to achieve a final diameter of 29 ½ inches over the shorter distance of 34 ½ inches compared to 58 ½ inches on the Xb.

It is true to say that the vertical horned gramophone has a different logarithmic rate of expansion to the Xb but, as said previously, it is a moot point as to whether the human ear can tell the difference !

All original "swan-neck" EMG horns were made in three sections---two aluminium castings joined at the "knuckle" and the final paper bell. This horn is no different but has required a unique small secondary casting for the centre section which would have demanded a "one-off" pattern. The fourth photo clearly shows the join to the bell. Inevitably there is always some shrinkage present which has taken place over the past 80 years.

It would seem that the final finish on the paper has been brushed on, going some way to explaining the excellent preservation of colours.

A wonderful exotic flower which clearly seems to have been designed and built by EMG and which resembles both the Mk IX and Mk Xb in intriguing ways.

Long may it continue to bloom !
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by chunnybh »

Excellent detective work Graham. Good to see this mystery solved, whatever the reasons for making it, it is an authentic EMG.

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by Orchorsol »

chunnybh wrote:Excellent detective work Graham. Good to see this mystery solved, whatever the reasons for making it, it is an authentic EMG.
I was lucky enough to spend a good deal of time with this machine too. Whilst not an engineer of Graham's calibre, I do have a technical background of many years in materials, moulding and manufacturing, and can indeed confirm it is original - especially the way the layered papier applique substrate meets the casting on the inner surface and envelops it on the outer, the way the rim is finished, the structure visible where the rim has become slightly abraded over the years, and countless other details and impressions when viewed in the flesh. All authentic EMG. Only the outer decoration on the horn surface is open to question (and the Expert rather than EMG soundbox of course). It's a real curio, and sounds as wonderful as one would expect.
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by epigramophone »

It is said that imitation is the sincerest form of flattery, but in this case I am not so sure...

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/400791591967? ... EBIDX%3AIT

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by emgcr »

What brass necks these young pretenders do have....!

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by kirtley2012 »

Here is something interesting.

When going through some boxes of stuff in my mums loft I was going through birthday cards and came across this one I got 9 years ago, I was obviously given it because it had gramophones on it, they didn’t know they were EMG’s, but we will see a familiar sight from this thread, but look closely, the pattern of the horn papers on the cards vertical horned EMG does not seem to match the one in the thread, the casting was painted dark brown, no evidence of that paint seems to have been found on the threads horn, the rim seems a bit more ragged and the internal of the horn darker (though that could be down to exposure), the knuckle seems wider too but that could be a perspective thing.
Has the horn earlier in the thread been refinished somehow, or was there once two of these strange beasts?

Perhaps we’ll never know
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by Orchorsol »

What a great card someone gave you Alex! :D Obviously a composite of various photos from elsewhere - I'm thinking the image of the vertical-ish EMG could even have been from the auction in Canterbury where the current owner bought the one discussed in this thread, 10 years ago or more - I can kind of see what you mean about it not matching, but I'm not certain, maybe a different part of the horn? It would be very exciting if it's not unique though!
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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by gunnarthefeisty »

I imagine this has the rather peculiar sound of a Portable, what with the sound bouncing off the ceiling.

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Re: Vertical-horned EMG.

Post by JerryVan »

gunnarthefeisty wrote: Fri Oct 15, 2021 12:54 am I imagine this has the rather peculiar sound of a Portable, what with the sound bouncing off the ceiling.
You would imagine wrong I suspect.

As stated previously by another poster,

"It was incredible to meet this bizarre variant in the flesh, and the sound was indeed fantastic as you say, with the immediate reflection and dispersal from the ceiling - much more like the familiar EMG delivery than I was expecting (I'd imagined that listening off-axis/off-beam in this way would diminish the acoustic performance in various ways). The holographic presence perceived inside and projecting from the bell of conventional EMGs wasn't there in the same way of course, but the lifelike tonal qualities were there in abundance, and the listening experience was wonderful."

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