HMV 102 - help dating and few questions/concerns

[burke]

Hi 102 fans,

I just received my first 102 after a years wait.

The person I bought it from took an entire year to send it after I'd paid ... but that aggravation aside it did arrive this week. To be fair he did re-grease the motor and did some other work and the price was crazy low [200 Canadian].

So first question - can someone with access to one of the HMV resource books give me an approximate date? I found a similar one in the forum, but the serial number began 1020 ... mine is 1021 ...

The sound is very good, but not quite as good as I'd expected There is a lot of hype about these and that may have given me false expectations.

Its good on the high end frequencies but not so great on the lower end when compared to my Consolette.

As you see its a 5b and it looks to be in pretty good shape. When I swapped sound boxes my Consolette orthophonic on the 102 sounded better ... unfortunately the 5b would not fit the Consolette.

I'm wondering if a new insulator might help. Also there is a bit of play in the tonearm [the elbow and where it connects to the motor board ... maybe a bit of sealing with teflon tape might help].

The latch on the case doesn't seem to match the ones I've seen online, but it does look original - anyone seen that type before?

The handle is also odd as well - same question.

Last - I found some very odd looking needles in the needle box! Hopefully the pictures are good enough, but if not they are painted yellow with the tips left bare ... what the heck are they?

4.jpg (61.83 KiB) Viewed 2599 times

10.jpg (50.79 KiB) Viewed 2599 times

Thanks

Darrell

[OrthoFan]

The lower-midrange response for an HMV 102 should be about the same as the Consolette, though not as loud, or pronounced, depending on the acoustic conditions of the room. If you set the portable on a hard, flat surface, epsecially an un-carpeted floor, you will probably hear a noticeable difference.

If it has a higher-pitch tone, that may be the result of too much tension in the needle bar mounting. This setting can be adjusted. Ideally, there should be as little tension as possible--just enough to prevent "side play" or the back and forth movement of the needle-bar in the direction of the support lugs. When I had my 5a rebuilt, there was no side play, and I could feel the diaphragm flex slightly when I tightened the needle-bar thumbscrew.

Along this line, as with the Orthophonic sound box, there should be no air leaks. You can either test for this by blowing VERY GENTLY into throat of the diaphragm.

It's also been my experience that, compared to the Orthophonic sound box, the 5a & 5b sound boxes were not as "powerful," pumping out less of a room-filling sound quality--though from what I could tell, their range was the same. As with the Orthophonic sound box, a carefully adjusted HMV version will sound better with use.

OrthoFan

[burke]

Thanks OthoFan,

I had just been perusing the late great Mr. Barber's website with his very fine instructions on that very adjustment.

http://www.restore-a-gram.co.uk/hmv-no- ... 4589510400

I believe I will follow your advise and have a go at some adjustment of the needle-bar.

[Phono48]

Sorry to sound negative, but the lid catch is certainly wrong, you can see two redundant screw holes just under the bottom half, and the carrying handle is missing it's leather covering. New ones are available on ebay. The soundbox looks to be in very bad condition, with multiple cracks on its' pot-metal backplate. If it has distorted, then it won't be sealed all the way round, which would account for the disappointing reproduction. The round clip that holds the turntable in place during transit is also missing. Regarding the looseness of the arm at it's base, take the arm off and look underneath. There is a round ring with two slots in the rim. This ring needs to be tightened (I use a pair of pointed pliers opened out), but don't overdo the tightening or the arm will be stiff. Whatever you do, don't remove that ring, or the whole thing will fall apart, with the loss of all the ball bearings, and it's the devils' own job to reassemble unless you have four hands! The needles are Columbia, and were supposed to play 60 sides before wearing out, but in fact struggled to play 10 sided without losing their point. HMV issued identical ones, but theirs were painted red.

[Phono48]

The needles are Columbia, and were supposed to play 60 sides before wearing out, but in fact struggled to play 10 sided without losing their point. HMV issued identical ones, but theirs were painted red.

I got that the wrong way round! The yellow needles are HMV, and the red ones were Columbia "Chromium".

[burke]

Sorry to sound negative, but the lid catch is certainly wrong, you can see two redundant screw holes just under the bottom half, and the carrying handle is missing it's leather covering. New ones are available on ebay. The soundbox looks to be in very bad condition, with multiple cracks on its' pot-metal backplate. If it has distorted, then it won't be sealed all the way round, which would account for the disappointing reproduction. The round clip that holds the turntable in place during transit is also missing. Regarding the looseness of the arm at it's base, take the arm off and look underneath. There is a round ring with two slots in the rim. This ring needs to be tightened (I use a pair of pointed pliers opened out), but don't overdo the tightening or the arm will be stiff. Whatever you do, don't remove that ring, or the whole thing will fall apart, with the loss of all the ball bearings, and it's the devils' own job to reassemble unless you have four hands! The needles are Columbia, and were supposed to play 60 sides before wearing out, but in fact struggled to play 10 sided without losing their point. HMV issued identical ones, but theirs were painted red.

Not negative at all

You just confirmed what I was fairly certain of already, about the latch and the handle.

My pictures were not great and I'm happy to report that the back plate looks much worse than it is -all that crackling is paint and the pot-metal is intact [it passed Othofan's 'blow test' with flying colours]. Great information about tightening the tonearm.

Chromium needles! Well that is completely new to me!

Thanks for the reply.

[burke]

BTW - still quite curious as to the approximate date of this portable if someone has the knowledge or access to one of the HMV books I've seen mentioned in other posts.

Cheers

[epigramophone]

Your 102 dates from about 1935. From 1936 HMV introduced a date code with a "B" prefix to the Serial Number, B/1 for 1936, B/2 for 1937 and so on. Your 102 does not have this prefix.

Another dating guide is the needle tray, which changed from metal to plastic in about 1935. It is not clear from the pictures which yours has.

The original soundbox is likely to have been a No.5A, but many machines have acquired the No.5B over the years, and I would not worry about that.

I assume you are aware that the detachable record storage tray is missing. They often are, but they can sometimes be found on UK eBay at a price.

[burke]

Your 102 dates from about 1935. From 1936 HMV introduced a date code with a "B" prefix to the Serial Number, B/1 for 1936, B/2 for 1937 and so on. Your 102 does not have this prefix.

Another dating guide is the needle tray, which changed from metal to plastic in about 1935. It is not clear from the pictures which yours has.

The original soundbox is likely to have been a No.5A, but many machines have acquired the No.5B over the years, and I would not worry about that.

I assume you are aware that the detachable record storage tray is missing. They often are, but they can sometimes be found on UK eBay at a price.

Thanks epigramophone!

1935 very good. Metal tray BTW

Not concerned about the storage tray at this time but I might down the road, but I wouldn't mind finding the correct latch ... the closest modern versions come up when I search "square draw box latch" - but nothing exact

[burke]

Your 102 dates from about 1935. From 1936 HMV introduced a date code with a "B" prefix to the Serial Number, B/1 for 1936, B/2 for 1937 and so on. Your 102 does not have this prefix.

Another dating guide is the needle tray, which changed from metal to plastic in about 1935. It is not clear from the pictures which yours has.

The original soundbox is likely to have been a No.5A, but many machines have acquired the No.5B over the years, and I would not worry about that.

I assume you are aware that the detachable record storage tray is missing. They often are, but they can sometimes be found on UK eBay at a price.

Thanks epigramophone!


BTW - because of your help with the date I was able to find this listing on a UK site of a machine with a very close number and same round badge.

https://www.worthpoint.com/worthopedia/ ... -271467177

1935 very good. Metal tray BTW

Not concerned about the storage tray at this time but I might down the road, but I wouldn't mind finding the correct latch ... the closest modern versions come up when I search "square draw box latch" - but nothing exact