1925 HMV Model 460 "Lumiere" Gramophone

[zippy]

Hi all,
I came across an HMV model 460 in an excellent condition. It is a fabulous piece with the gold plated diaphragm. How rare is HMV model 460 in good condition? Any idea about the price of it?

Thank you

[epigramophone]

Over three years ago I helped to clear a collection of machines from a deceased estate, including an HMV460.
The outer mahogany case was in poor condition, but the interior including the all important diaphragm was very well preserved.
The machine sold at auction in February 2017 for GBP£800 against a pre-sale estimate of £300/£500. I would expect one in excellent all round condition to make over £1000.

[phonosandradios]

What does one of these sound like compared to a usual horn arrangement? I've never heared one but have always imagined that it would be quieter and with a more limited range of sound both upper and lower frequencies but is that correct?

[zippy]

Over three years ago I helped to clear a collection of machines from a deceased estate, including an HMV460.
The outer mahogany case was in poor condition, but the interior including the all important diaphragm was very well preserved.
The machine sold at auction in February 2017 for GBP£800 against a pre-sale estimate of £300/£500. I would expect one in excellent all round condition to make over £1000.

Thanks epigramophone!
According to the Worthpoint website, there are two models sold on eBay in 2013. One was sold for $1603.70 and another for $5499. I am shocked to see the one for $5499.

[zippy]

What does one of these sound like compared to a usual horn arrangement? I've never heared one but have always imagined that it would be quieter and with a more limited range of sound both upper and lower frequencies but is that correct?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rnEH4AyqW1M

[epigramophone]

This 460 was up for auction today. The "Current Bid" shown may not be the final hammer price :

https://auctions.jsfineart.co.uk/auctio ... 8c00d786ef

[zippy]

This 460 was up for auction today. The "Current Bid" shown may not be the final hammer price :

https://auctions.jsfineart.co.uk/auctio ... 8c00d786ef

Sold for 950 GBP! You are spot on!

[CarlosV]

What does one of these sound like compared to a usual horn arrangement? I've never heared one but have always imagined that it would be quieter and with a more limited range of sound both upper and lower frequencies but is that correct?

I have some of these machines, a 460, a 461 and two French counterparts. Its sound is quite nice for acoustic records, it is not directional as a horn, but it basically cuts off the bass spectrum, so electric recordings sound very thin. The big problem with these machines is the drag caused by the diaphragm, that imparts a very high wear to the discs. The French version is a little more benign, because its diaphragm is set parallel to the turntable, but it also is a record-muncher.

[Sidewinder]

The French version is a little more benign, because its diaphragm is set parallel to the turntable, but it also is a record-muncher.

And the turntable is at a slant of about 30 degrees

[snallast]

I also have one, it's been my daily player for a few months now. It's a tricky machine, challenging and rewarding. It's taken me time to learn how to adjust the weight of the diaphragm, which by the way needs to be adjusted according to what records you're playing.
I do not find that it wears records when adjusted properly.
Electric records sound great with bamboo needles - well acoustic ones too!
I can understand why it was not a hit with the public... it is too demanding technically, most people wouldn't have had the patience or the know-how and would end up with ruined records...