Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

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kirtley2012
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Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by kirtley2012 »

BAD!

I was the one crazy enough to buy it, and I did it for a couple of reasons, I am able to fix it, I was curious about what he has actually done to the horn, and also, I really didn't want someone to buy it thinking they've finally, at long last bought an EMG with their hard earned money, only to find it to be this, I know what I was like when I first got obsessed by EMG, I'd have been utterly heartbroken if I didn't know what I was getting into.

Lets side step the horn for now, and focus on the base.
It is a later post war EMG IX circa 1946/7, it came with an EMG 2 spring horseshoe soundbox (I have removed this in the photos as I instantly took it to pieces to fix a couple of issues with it, including a loose needle bar, a very small split towards the center of the diaphragm, Ill fitting gaskets and an incorrect spring screw.

The motorboard has had a few different additions, some arm rests I really can't see why they're there, there is a hole in the lower left hand side, this was present when the gramophone was sold at Tennants (in original condition) in 2019, so it had likely been sent back to EMG to have a different motor fitted, this thought is re-enforced by the EMG plaque sporting an address of 6 Newman Street, EMG moved to Newman Street on 19/4/1948, and since the silver plaque on the front of the gramophone states that it was 'Presented To Sir Hugh and Lady Bell on the occasion of their marriage October 17th 1947 by The Tenants of Rounton and Arncliffe Estates', before the date of the move, shows this was a Grape Street built gramophone, sent back to EMG for a different motor between 1948 and 1967, at which point they changed the Grape Street plaque to the updated address of Newman Street.
The gramophone has however always been an electric motored example.
(EDIT, the hole to the lower left hand side of the deckboard is now realised to be from an electric tonearm and pickup, the motor is likely the original one, and perhaps EMG fitted this electric pickup sometime in the 50's? this is speculation however)

When it appeared in the 2019 sale the cabinet was in its original yet tired finish, the man I bought it off who ruined the horn, also stripped the finish off of the case exterior and refinished it in totally the wrong colour, this will be re-re-finished back to the original colour.

Now, onto the meaty subject, that god awful horn, long story short, it is destroyed, totally gone beyond repair.
When the machine appeared in the 2019 sale, the horn was untouched, but had sagged and collapsed, by no means, however un-repairable, below I will picture a horn I received from Graham Rankin in 2011, that horn was in the same condition, bent double and collapsed, though you can see fitted an aluminium horn jack I have produced to slowly over time raise the horn, it is certainly most of the way there, remember that THESE HORNS WERE IN ALMOST THE SAME SHAPE!
Well that horn for now has found a home on this IX base until I undertake the next step on the repair and re-build of the destroyed horn.
But why is is beyond repair you ask?, well taking a look down the back of the horn, you see it totally covered in some kind of thick resin or something similar, it's certainly not paper, it's certainly not smooth, it's certainly not exponential, I wonder how much of the original horn is left under there, I will peel back the awful papers and share the horror here, I can say however, the entire horn is about twice as heavy as an original IX horn, so I think the whole thing might be drenched in that resin.
Also, many saw that strange piece of silver plumbing which seemed to serve no purpose, well I found the purpose, the horn has been so twisted and mangled that it won't actually fit on the base with the lid up so that raised it up above the issue to make up for his poor effort, unfortunately in order to fit his bodge, he cut two slots into the horn spigot, not all the way through, but still enough to cause potential air leaks, so I may have to fill these slots with a resin and smooth over, or make a new bronze spigot for when that casting is put back into use.

He has totally destroyed and utterly butchered an EMG horn which had real potential had I got my hands on it to restore it in time, luckily I had a spare IX horn which for all the time I've had it has been living on a HMV model 31, but the horn this IX was fitted with is not a lost cause yet, many have seen the absolutely fantastic Oversize horns Graham Rankin produced made out of fiberglass (I am the very recent and very proud owner of one), well, over the course of some time, I am going to make a horn mold and a collapsible wooden section to make the bend, in order to make a Fiberglass IX horn using the original EMG casting, this won't be a quick project, but will be one I'm going to slowly work on.

I will update progress as it goes on, first step will be putting the cabinet back to rights by refinishing it and making the motor board presentable again, overall, an easy project?, no, but I like a challenge, and another one WILL be saved.

I did get a second EMG strobe with it, so that's something!
The IX as it appeared at Tennants Auction January 30th 2019
The IX as it appeared at Tennants Auction January 30th 2019
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That shouldn't be like that...
That shouldn't be like that...
The horn fouling on the case, not able to be turned, and the lid not able to be shut
The horn fouling on the case, not able to be turned, and the lid not able to be shut
Just nasty.
Just nasty.
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Come on baby, and lets do the twist....
Come on baby, and lets do the twist....
Better already!
Better already!
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Spot the difference....
Spot the difference....
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Last edited by kirtley2012 on Fri Oct 29, 2021 5:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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kirtley2012
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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by kirtley2012 »

Being a professional luthier, I have seen a lot of bodges on vintage guitars, this horn, by far, is the biggest bodge job I have seen.
The horn has been so mutilated I cant tell what is left of the original horn, and the twisted section has been hacked together, covered in a layer of fiberglass, then some resin based filler, then newspaper, then the ugly plastic based reptile paper, even getting the casting out will be a trick,
Luckily I went into this gramophone knowing the horn to be a lost cause, still, it's even worse than first thought!
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Last edited by kirtley2012 on Fri Oct 29, 2021 5:14 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by JerryVan »

Was this "repair" done by Mr. Bean? :shock:

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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by TinfoilPhono »

What a shame! The last owner really did a horrible job.

I'm glad it has found its way to the right home. I don't know many people who have your skills or perseverance.

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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by Orchorsol »

Well done Alex and thanks for such a comprehensive and informative write-up - even if much of it is a horror story (just right for Halloween)!

The extra holes and extra arm rest are telling me that a previous owner added an electrical arm at some point.

I'll be VERY interested once you're able to re-work or construct Mk IX horns - as mentioned previously elsewhere, I have one broken in two and another that's little more than the casting, wanting to be made whole again!
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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by kirtley2012 »

Orchorsol wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 5:29 pm Well done Alex and thanks for such a comprehensive and informative write-up - even if much of it is a horror story (just right for Halloween)!

The extra holes and extra arm rest are telling me that a previous owner added an electrical arm at some point.

I'll be VERY interested once you're able to re-work or construct Mk IX horns - as mentioned previously elsewhere, I have one broken in two and another that's little more than the casting, wanting to be made whole again!
Ah, of course, I now realise the holes to the front left hand side of the deck board are from a previously fitted electric tonearm rather than an earlier motor, I wonder if that could have been fitted by EMG, it clearly went back to the works for something, but if not a new motor, what, I wonder

I am able to re-build your horn broken in two now, re-attaching the original bell much the way I have done on broken/breaking in two horns before, but yes, at some stage in the future I am intending on re-building stray castings, that will be a little ways away yet
Last edited by kirtley2012 on Fri Oct 29, 2021 5:46 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by kirtley2012 »

TinfoilPhono wrote: Fri Oct 29, 2021 5:22 pm What a shame! The last owner really did a horrible job.

I'm glad it has found its way to the right home. I don't know many people who have your skills or perseverance.
Thanks Rene!

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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by emgcr »

Well done Alex and I too am very glad it has found the right home. Quite unbelievable how someone could have destroyed a horn so comprehensively. Making the collapsible former will be intriguing (and very skilled) but, when successfully achieved, will put you on the road to doing the same thing to produce Expert horns.......!

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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by epigramophone »

It is very encouraging to see a young person acquiring the necessary skills to restore these wonderful machines.
The prophets of doom are wrong. The future of our hobby will be in safe hands such as yours.

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Re: Twisty horn EMG Mk IX - So, how bad was it?

Post by Inigo »

Alex, great purchase, as it is going to the perfect home to be rescued to his former glory. Nice. We'll follow your process with interest, and surely learn a lot thanks to your perseverance and patience! :)
Inigo

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