Tin Can Berliner - Taking Bids!

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cmshapiro
Victor I
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Re: Tin Can Berliner - Taking Bids!

Post by cmshapiro »

gramophoneshane wrote: Wed May 25, 2022 3:11 pm
Skihawx wrote: Mon May 23, 2022 6:33 am Where did I see that the bidding was up to $45,000? It had to be this thread. Was it just one post that was deleted?
Yes, it was in this thread.
Apparently the person who posted had been in touch with the seller and was informed the price was up to $45K.
I have to wonder how much truth was in that statement now it's gone.
I suppose if that person was actually the highest offer at say $15K, lying about the highest offer might scare off a lot of the competition?

Some people will say or do anything if they think it will give them an advantage
Well the chances of buying a machine that last sold at auction for $55k, for $15k when the buyer and seller are educated on the actual value, are zero. This is not a question of ethics regarding the seller, this is a situation of how the market works. If it had gone to auction, it would have surely gone for $40-50k. In this case the seller is much better off with a non-auction sale. Who wants to lose 20-25% in auction house commissions if they do not have to? I have been in several deals where the highest offer was what the selling price would be. It is often both the right offer, AND a buyer who knows how to conduct the art of making a deal happen who wins the prize. In all of those cases I walked away with an amazing piece for my collection, and the seller happy with a nice sum of cash. To have walked away because it wasn't being handled by a "reputable auction house" (or even taken a bit of a fight) would have been a fools errand.

gramophoneshane
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Re: Tin Can Berliner - Taking Bids!

Post by gramophoneshane »

You still have to wonder why the post was removed if it was truthful

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Raphael
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Re: Tin Can Berliner - Taking Bids!

Post by Raphael »

As both a collector and a dealer who often buys items upwards of $25000, I would not participate in such a scheme. If a seller won’t name a price, I won’t make an offer. Just recently, at the Wayne show, I asked a seller what the price would be for “x” (I won’t disclose the item because it would identify him to others). He replied “just make me an offer”. I simply said no thanks and walked away while he berated me.
In this day and age, even the oldest of the old fossils among us know how to use a computer and research the sales history of most anything. Conducting a never-ending, “private auction” is, to my mind a nefarious way of double-dealing.

Raphael

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Skihawx
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Re: Tin Can Berliner - Taking Bids!

Post by Skihawx »

Some might think that sounds more like a dealer than a collector.

Starkton
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Re: Tin Can Berliner - Taking Bids!

Post by Starkton »

[quote=AllenKoe post_id=314657 time=1653242540 user_id=918]
Hi

Is it "typical" for this early ratchet-wound machine 1896-1897, to have the aluminum ID plate stamped with the wording of: "Berliner Gramophone Co." [Philadelphia].

Should we expect "National Gramophone Co."?

Allen
[/quote]

I guess the machine was sold through the retail store of the Berliner Gramophone Co. at N. E. Corner 13th and Chestnut Streets, which would mean that not only records were distributed there.

AllenKoe
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Re: Tin Can Berliner - Taking Bids!

Post by AllenKoe »

Is it "typical" for this early ratchet-wound machine 1896-1897, to have the aluminum ID plate stamped with the wording of: "Berliner Gramophone Co."
Thank you, Starkton,

I still think it is unusual to have an oval aluminum ID plate being used in 1896-97? Although the "Berliner Gramophone Co." WAS formed in Oct 1895, the use of such a plate (and geographical location) is usually connected with "late" sales of 1900? Can you suggest when you think this ratchet-wind model was sold? The serial # seems quite early.

Allen

TAP
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Re: Tin Can Berliner - Taking Bids!

Post by TAP »

I've seen a couple of tin cans with no tag and no evidence one was there (on what appeared to be the original base). I can't tell for sure but there appears to be a decal on the one in Baumbach's book. There are quite a few Aluminum tags on hand-winds but records suggest these could have been manufactured years after the tin can (1896).

It has been almost two weeks after the original post. Is the disposition of the tin can and the rest of the collection known?

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