Interesting old Pathéphone

[PeterF]

I chose the Standard as my example because they are everywhere here, in all kinds of different condition, and mostly quite cheap. Congrats on your nice find over there.

As for Guido: Yes, and if the mood is right when you see him, please ask him if the buyer of that reflex was in Europe or elsewhere. I’ve at times been tempted by some of his offerings but the shipping cost to here in the US quashed my interest. But one very wealthy US collector acquaintance I’ve known used to buy from him regularly despite this - probably because we just can’t get a lot of this stuff any other way.

I did buy a few great items from a French estate liquidation years ago, but we were able to collaborate closely on packing multiple items in a way (just beneath the weight and size parameters for each price level) that maximized shipping cost efficiency.

[Steve]

These are indeed quite interesting, whether some Europeans look down their noses at them or not. Perhaps they are quite common there, but I’ve only seen two others besides mine here in the US.

They are interesting because they use the reflex horn, which no major US maker did. Other than Pathé, and the Decca portables, are there any others? Pathé stuff, and other European stuff in general, tends to be more interesting (and way more confusing) to us in the US because there is just less of it to be found here.

And Jalal Aro STILL hasn’t gotten around to writing Look For The Rooster (or something like that)!

So I guess if someone put an incomplete and beat up Edison Standard on eBay here in the US for $100, some of us might snort a little, too. What would such an item attract in the UK?

Doubtful that folks would totally dump on the thing though.

And one more thing:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/285170010257

It might appear that Guido and at least one of his customers differ from the assessment that these are not interesting, or of value.

The grass is always greener on the other side of the…pond.

The grass is usually much greener on your side of the pond, certainly. American collectors would be mightily disheartened if they had the market here in the UK and parts of Europe to contend with. There are obviously many more fine machines Stateside than we'll ever see here whilst there aren't proportionately the same level of collectors fighting over them. Quite frankly you've never had it so good!

Regarding the Pathé reflex models, no one is dissing them. As I said I am a fan and if I could I'd collect all of them. I'd be a natural buyer of any book on Pathé instruments as I have quite a few machines in my collection and rate the product line well above that of the so called "Big Three", as one of the most diverse, eclectic, elegant and interesting range of instruments out there. If i could get access to Pathé organisation records I'd even have a go writing it myself! Fat chance of that though.

Where a few of us dismissed the machine in question it was down to the appalling state of this specific example and the ludicrous asking price. Is it worth it? No, not when you can buy a complete Elf for under £200. This and many other reflex models are not uncommon. That's not looking down our noses; that's simply stating fact. It's better to advise a prospective buyer towards obtaining a complete example in good condition, rather than a futile restoration project, if you know they exist.

That Elf fetching 1250 USD is a little absurd but I doubt the bidders realise these machines are available at a quarter of the price elsewhere or possibly even cared.

I think we're currently seeing perhaps the widest price differentials between different regions of the globe and dependent on the quality of the machine, that I can ever recall.

[CarlosV]

It might appear that Guido and at least one of his customers differ from the assessment that these are not interesting, or of value.

And Jalal Aro STILL hasn’t gotten around to writing Look For The Rooster (or something like that)!

My comment referred specifically to the poor condition of the machine that was pictured: as I wrote, the cost of the replacement parts and restoring its case will vastly surpass the price of a complete machine in good condition. Even if you are in the US and decide to import a complete one from France and add the cost of shipment and duties, it will be much cheaper than the one shown in the ad. As I also wrote, I have five variants of the machine, so at least to me they are very interesting.

A comprehensive book on Pathé machines would be great, however the reason for it never been written is that there are no archives that a prospective researcher could consult, opposite to EMI that still holds an organized archive on The Gramophone Co. These companies changed hands a number of times over the century, and the buyer usually gets rid of the documentation of the company that was acquired. That was the case of English Columbia, that lost their documentation when The Gramophone Co bought it in the 30s and kept only its own archives, and of Pathé, when Marconi bought it some years later. The only sources reachable today (until someone finds some boxes of old papers in a French attic) are advertisements and scattered books written by collectors like Marty, that tell about the company's history, show some samples, but were never intended to be comprehensive specialized compendiums like His Masters Gramophone that Oakley and Proudfoot wrote some years ago about The Gramophone Co.