Pathé model 17

[marcapra]

I went to look at a Pathé model 17, called the Louis XV model. Did Pathé sell both Pathéphone models alongside with the revolutionary Pathé Actuelle models? I used to think when they came out with the new Actuelle's that the older style models were no longer made. But examining the maker's plates, I see that both the Actuelle and Pathéphone models had the old black rectangular plate, as well as the newer plates with the red rooster. The Pathéphone that I went to see had the same problem I've seen on all of the Pathé Universal reproducer models. It no longer swivelled back and forth from lateral to vertical position, and the tone arm wouldn't even go down to the record! Even the needle screw was frozen and you couldn't change the steel needle. The ad said it worked great, but when non-phonograph people sell an old phonograph, "works great" means the turntable still goes around! I guess all of these Pathephones with the Universal reproducer have these pot metal problems? Has anyone found one that was otherwise?

[Kirkwood]

I have this same model, which is larger and more elegant than I had realized from the old advert illustrations.
Mine, too, had the reproducer frozen---into the Pathé/vertical cut position. I had assumed that it was sold this way, told the dealer it would need special Pathé discs to play on it, and got a pretty good deal. No worries, since I had plenty of Pathé discs.
After the fact, I was able to *carefully* free up the reproducer somewhat so that it would play the usual lateral cut discs. Can't recall now how I did it.
You could be right, that these models were available at the same time as the Actuelle. Perhaps the Actuelle wasn't perceived to be the successor to the standard models in the way that, say, the Orthophonics replaced the standard upright Victrolas of the earlier years.
By the way, my Actuelle won't accommodate the 14 inch Pathé discs, but this Pathé 17 will.

[FloridaClay]

The 17 should be quite handsome when cleaned up. I seldom see non-Actuelle Pathés except machines with very austere looking cases.

Good luck with the tone arm, etc. Wondering if one of the usual tricks might work--putting it in the freezer, taking it apart, and then sanding down a bit in appropriate places. I have never worked on one of those, so don't know if they were meant to be able to be taken apart.

Clay

[VintageTechnologies]

I can't really tell from the picture if the tonearm is gold-plated or nickel. I sometimes see complete nickel-plated Pathé tonearms with base and reproducer on eBay. Most often, the pot metal swivel that connects the base and tonearm has broken, but the pot metal reproducer heads usually seem intact. You may be able free the frozen head from the tonearm (they are designed to be taken apart), but if head should break, replacements are frequently available on eBay. You should definitely replace the hardened gaskets.

[Victrolacollector]

You have a nice machine there. The Pathé' arms and reproducers can exhibit problems with swollen tone arms etc. I purchased the Pathé' Model 60 a nice dark oak or walnut tabletop machine from a Brian in New Jersey who had alot of phonos for sale back around 2005. The machine runs great. Sometimes you can get one with good parts and sometimes you have to look around a little and find them. The Pathé arm should not be too difficult to find.

[marcapra]

Unfortunately, some previous owner knocked out two of the record shelves in the storage cabinet so they could store some small boxes in there. I don't know how you would go about fixing record shelves. I guess just buy the right thickness of wood, cut to size and try to mount it in there like the originals. Since I can't tell from the Pathé ads, which are just drawings or paintings of the machines, did Pathé's originally have grille cloths? I've never seen one with a grille cloth. Yes that tone arm is gold plated as the Model 17 was considered a higher end machine at $190, but not the highest machine. Also a caster is missing. Can you buy similar casters today?

[De Soto Frank]

For casters, check Van Dyke's Restorer's Supply - they carry a huge line of odd & ends for furniture / old house restoration.

I have a modest Pathéphone VII that a friend gave me about 10 years ago... the cabinet ( about the size and shape of an Edison Sheraton S-19) was fairly intact(other than having shed most of its wreath applique`s under the lid lip), but the motor was literally in pieces, rolling around inside the cabinet.

The tone-arm and reproducer head (all nickel-plated) and all their joints were free and operable.

I reassembled the motor, repaired a broken spring end, and fixed some broken governor springs, but could never get mine to run evenly or pull its way through a 12" record, so I got disgusted with it, and put it off to the side.

I would bet these machines originally had grille-cloths.

I just picked-up a nice oak Brunswick 117 upright, with the horn painted white, but there is evidence that there was originally a grille-cloth hide-glued to the backside of the grille.

[brokenspring]

I drove up from San Diego and bought this machine. The reason the tone arm wouldn't reach the record was that the sound box was bolted to the tone arm upside down and then the arm was turned 180 so that the needle was pointing down. One of the springs was disconnected from the barrel and it wouldn't wind up. I followed the recommendations I had read on this forum about putting the tone arm in the freezer to get it unstuck. So now the sound box can be put in both lateral and vertical positions. After I fixed the spring the phonograph played well.It was fun to work on and get it's voice back.

[pughphonos]

Good job, Brokenspring. Always nice to read when people take on "hard cases" and restore them to functionality.

In response to an earlier post in this string, it does seem that Pathé in the U.S. manufactured both the Actuelles and their standard internal horn machines simultaneously in around 1918-1922, and then after the discontinuance of the Actuelles in around 1922 the U.S. company had a few more years of life (to around 1926?) during which it used just the "universal tone arm."

I have an empty Pathé "Sheraton" cabinet (the works were stripped out years ago) that has a smaller lift lid on the right side--so as to access a conventional tone-arm. My theory is that this was Pathé's way of using up the leftover Sheraton cabinets that had originally housed Actuelle mechanisms--but those cabinets had a larger lift lid cut into the CENTER of the top (I owned one of those for awhile too).

Ralph