Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

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James
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by James »

bigshot wrote:Are you talking about the orthophonic style Brunswick reproducer or the Ultona?

I've never heard the Columbia, but my Cortez definitely sounds better than any pre-orthophonic machine... It even sounds better than the Credenza. The Victor has a little more bass, but it sounds diffused and distant compared to the present forward sound of the Cortez.

I am talking about the reproducer of Brunswick Panatrope portable which is orthophonic style. I use it with an adapter on the Highboy Edison William and Mary to play orthophonic style with steel needles for 78rpm, tilt the adapter use sapphire point needle 'hola' your vertical recordings. Ultona is the reproducer for acoustic Brunswick machines.

I agree with you, my floor model Brunswick Panatrope Cortez is my favourite. It sound sharp and clear with bass. The Columbia Viva tonal 810 is not too far away, the Victor Credenza sound like the recording is coming from within a cave, pardon me, but this is the opinion of my untrained ear.


Jim

bigshot
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by bigshot »

I have an adapter like that to use an Orthophonic sound box off a VV 2-65 on my VV-X, but it really doesn't sound very good because of the small horn.

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audiophile102
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by audiophile102 »

This might be a bit off topic, but can anyone tell me if there is any value to these two 12" Victor record books? I thought they might be for orthophonic machines. The paper sleeves and the binders are in great shape. There is some spots on the covers. I did an internet search and can't find any quite like these.
Victor Books2.JPG
Attachments
Victor Books5.JPG
Victor Books4.JPG
Victor Books3.JPG
Last edited by audiophile102 on Sat Oct 31, 2015 10:52 am, edited 1 time in total.
"You can't take the phonographs nor the money with you, but the contentment the phonographs bring may well make your life better, and happier lives make the world a better place."

bigshot
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by bigshot »

RCA indicates it's post-Victor, so they wouldn't go with Orthophonics. They look to me like late 1930s.

larryh
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by larryh »

James wrote:
bigshot wrote:Are you talking about the orthophonic style Brunswick reproducer or the Ultona?

I've never heard the Columbia, but my Cortez definitely sounds better than any pre-orthophonic machine... It even sounds better than the Credenza. The Victor has a little more bass, but it sounds diffused and distant compared to the present forward sound of the Cortez.

I am talking about the reproducer of Brunswick Panatrope portable which is orthophonic style. I use it with an adapter on the Highboy Edison William and Mary to play orthophonic style with steel needles for 78rpm, tilt the adapter use sapphire point needle 'hola' your vertical recordings. Ultona is the reproducer for acoustic Brunswick machines.

I agree with you, my floor model Brunswick Panatrope Cortez is my favourite. It sound sharp and clear with bass. The Columbia Viva tonal 810 is not too far away, the Victor Credenza sound like the recording is coming from within a cave, pardon me, but this is the opinion of my untrained ear.


Jim
That is what led me to sell mine. It could produce a lot of things well and when I had nothing to compare it too it seemed very good. But that day I listened to both the Edison 250 and the Credenza there was no contest as to which sounded like the instruments are actually in the living room from a couple rooms away with wide openings. The description of being in a cave is about right. I never did like the red seal symphonic albums all that well either, the generally played a bit strident to my ear. The orthophonic Victor Symphony things on black label for some reason were much better in clarity.

Larry

gunnarthefeisty
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by gunnarthefeisty »

James wrote: Fri Oct 30, 2015 8:43 am
larryh wrote:At one time I had the Credenza as well as the 810. Both were good but like many others here I thought it had a slight edge on the Credenza in sound quality.

Fast forward to today. I have been playing many records on the Edison William and Mary Console some of which I made videos of. I do have quite a nice collection of vertical records of Victor, Columbia, Brunswick ect. In order to hear them in my small home I have been playing three different types of portable machines. One a Orthohonic Victor, due to a lousy rebuild I converted it to a #2 reproducer. The second a Panatrope and the Third a Telefunken. I hadn't originally brought the Telefunken in to the mix because it has a touchy motor and won't always play though a record. (Although the Brunswick also has to be cranked to the max to make it though many selections). In playing a good trio record of Piano, Violin an Cello I noted quite quickly how much more tone was coming from the tiny Telefunken cabinet. The reproducer is large, similar to the #4 Victor in size. Everything else about it is minimal, weight is a fourth the others, the horn is comparably tiny and yet the sound is very satisfying. It way outplays the #2 reproducer I just had rebuilt and it avoids a slightly tinny effect the Panatrope reproducer has in some places. Its also the loudest machine of that type. I have to use a soft tone needle or it will drive you out of the room. Not sure how they create the fullness of tone but in some ways I think Mica is a more suitable diaphragm for vertical play records. The Brunswick is no slouch and I was actually surprised when I compared records between it and the Telefunken that the latter has this warm solid tone which gave it an edge overall.

The 810 is long gone as well as the Credenza.. I parted with the Credenza when I had both it and a S19 in the living room and realized that the Edison was much more lifelike than the Victor and decided to move it out. Surprisingly in many ways a decent portable can provide a larger sound in the room than a standard type victrola using a standard horn. I think its the way it has a rather unimpeded ability to project the sound in a wider pattern.

Larry
I also play electrically recorded records on my Edison William and Mary highboy, using Brunswick Panatrope reproducer and, it sound tremendous due perhaps with the steel large 250 horn. You hear the amazing bass. Turning the reproducer to play European classical Pathé, you can hear some amazing sound never heard playing with the Pathé reproducer and, clearer sound.


Jim
I know this is an ancient thread, but what kind of tonearm do you use for the panatrope reproducer?

BillH_NJ
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by BillH_NJ »

Great stuff! I keep hoping to find a Cortez, and the largest Viva Tonal I have is a 720. I do have both one of my Credenzas and a Sonora Philharmonic is different corners of the dining room, and for a while I had a second Credenza there as well. It is a bit tough to find room for multiple large machines, and I don’t know what I will do if I ever get my Brunswick Panatrope 42 in working condition. A Victorian house with a lot of 13’ x 13’ (or thereabouts) rooms doesn’t lend itself well to a lot of photos.

Bill

AmberolaAndy
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by AmberolaAndy »

I would like to see the Credenza clone type machines all together in one collection. (Along with the big 3) It would be interesting to compare all of them together.

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travisgreyfox
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by travisgreyfox »

Cool discussion and even cooler machines in this thread :coffee:

gunnarthefeisty
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Re: Orthoponic and orthophonic styles machines

Post by gunnarthefeisty »

BillH_NJ wrote: Sun Oct 10, 2021 8:48 pm Great stuff! I keep hoping to find a Cortez, and the largest Viva Tonal I have is a 720. I do have both one of my Credenzas and a Sonora Philharmonic is different corners of the dining room, and for a while I had a second Credenza there as well. It is a bit tough to find room for multiple large machines, and I don’t know what I will do if I ever get my Brunswick Panatrope 42 in working condition. A Victorian house with a lot of 13’ x 13’ (or thereabouts) rooms doesn’t lend itself well to a lot of photos.

Bill
I would take a Cortez over a 42 any day. Im planning on saving up for one, and hopefully managing to find one up here in MN.

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