Edison Amberola cabinet w/B-250 guts another "X" marking

[DGPros]

So another misfit has followed me home. I have seen 2 other postings on this subject here http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... f=2&t=6166 and here http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... =2&t=27117 .

I've also posted about a variation on this theme here http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... =2&t=33219

This would make a 3rd "X" Amberola cabinet with B-250 gut? Are there any others I may have missed?

So too the topic.

1) The lid has both the Edison logo ,though not centered, and the amberola logo.
2) cabinet has #76 on back door opening and on underside of door. (I have not found it anywhere else yet)
3) ID plate has X96 but no model #
4) Amberola Notch on lip and lid.
5) early vented sides,cylinder drawers (# 1-4 on side, no holes for cylinder clips)
6) B-bedplate and single spring motor and horizontal muff volume control
7) later reproducer with 28989? tough to read with gold paint
8) A 200 grill(never tried to fit one so not sure if it was modified to fit.
9) a few screw holes,both sides, next to the bed plate braces,(maroon colored) and an odd circular marking


These are the few things I've noticed, other than in the recent past someone painted the gold parts and tried to refinish the cabinet half halfheartedly. Let me know if I've missed anything, or if you want me to look closer anywhere? Obviously anyone over the years could have added the grill and reproducer, along with many other parts, yet this is what we have now.



Fran, let me know if this should be added to your A-250's list.

[52089]

Gary,

As the owner of X122 (http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... =2&t=27117), I'd like to welcome you to the "club"! Congrats!

I suspect if you take the lid hinge off, you'll find the serial number stamped there as well.

Fran will probably ask you the questions he asked about mine, so you might as well start checking that now.

I will also be happy to provide further info about my machine and how it does/doesn't compare to yours, now that we have 2 to work with.

Cheers,
Kevin

[phonogfp]

Wow - another fascinating machine! Like the others shown in earlier threads (thanks for including those!), this carries enough clues to prevent the typical "cobbled together" reaction we collectors use when we see something that doesn't fit the mold.

That "X" marking means something, and there's almost a pattern here...

George P.

[DGPros]

I have taken the hinge off, but have not found any markings yet. The bad restoration of the unit may be covering up what's underneath. I will get to it soon, hopefully. I will be reaching out Kevin for comparisons and contrasts. It would be great to find a few more "X" variations for such a task. I may have to reach out to the facebook sites to see if we can find more. Until then, anyone else here have or seen one?

[fran604g]

Very interesting Gary, congratulations.

I'll take a better look at your images tomorrow, but right away, I get the feeling that perhaps we're looking at the mechanism and grill from a B-150 in an Amberola cabinet?

Best,
Fran

[fran604g]

P.S.: What's the horn?

[DGPros]

Black 250

[fran604g]

I wonder if the grill might possibly also be from an Amberola III. The III and A 150 cabinets (and presumably the B 150, too) are nearly identical dimensionally. I know the horn openings are identical in those 2 cabinets, for all intents and purposes.

Best,
Fran

[DGPros]

I've been wondering about the grill myself. I believe this to be all original, the grill is the biggest question mark for me at this point. I would love to hear some more of your thoughts. At first glance i believe the horn to be a 250, i will double check myself tomorrow after work. It definitely isn't the A variety 2 piece.

[fran604g]

I've been wondering about the grill myself. I believe this to be all original, the grill is the biggest question mark for me at this point. I would love to hear some more of your thoughts. At first glance i believe the horn to be a 250, i will double check myself tomorrow after work. It definitely isn't the A variety 2 piece.

To me, it just looks as if an outer frame of larger dimensions was added to the existing III/150 grille to fit the larger Amberola I horn opening -- instead of the slightly smaller "frame" that would've been originally used.

The motor governor and unpainted mainspring barrel appear to be consistent with the earliest B-type mechanisms I've observed, although the motor plate finish is what I refer to as the "2nd type" of color scheme I've observed (black with maroon operational decals). The earliest 2-spring governor that I've observed had a slot milled into the governor sleeve, mated to a roller bearing fastened with a precision machine screw to the governor shaft -- thereby creating a "shock-proof" governor...meaning the start and stop torsional effects of the weights were less likely to cause bending and distortion to the governor weight springs and creating undesirable speed fluctuations to the motor.

I notice yours has 2 hemispherical weights; does it also have the roller bearing and milled governor sleeve?

Additionally, as has been discussed in other posts previously and just to reiterate for any newer readers following this post, I'm thinking the "X" on these anomalies was stamped on the dataplate to signify no patent licensing agreement for whomever built and owned them. Remember that purchasing a patented machine from any of the various manufacturers of the period would've limited the purchaser from certain activities related to that purchase. One didn't actually own the "rights" to the machine (I think I have that correct). Presumedly this would've had to have happened at the factory, as has been discussed in other posts -- suggesting the parts were an employee discounted purchase for obsolete and/or damaged components?

I don't know how you manage to find these "gems", but kudos for finding them!

Best,
Fran