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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Fri Nov 20, 2020 11:58 pm 
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Victor III
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Joined: Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:37 pm
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Location: Knoxville Tennessee
The paint is about 99% off the cabinet! I met with the woodworker today and I’ll be bringing the cabinet back to him once I’m done with finals. He is going to help me repair the wood, and refinish the cabinet.

Does the veneer need to be 3/64” thick? Or would 1/64” be fine for replacing the veneer on the top of the cabinet?

Here’s some pics! (I just put the pieces back together for this pic)

David


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 4:26 am 
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Victor IV
Joined: Wed Jan 07, 2009 11:07 pm
Posts: 1128
Location: München, Bayern
A worthy project. Good luck!


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 12:16 pm 
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Victor VI
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:08 pm
Posts: 3257
Location: Harrison Township, MI
David,

I would definitely opt for the thicker veneer. But, more than that, I would seriously consider making a whole new top for that cabinet. The warping and cupping that you have there will be nearly impossible to correct.


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 12:57 pm 
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Victor III
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college collector
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Location: Knoxville Tennessee
JerryVan wrote:
David,

I would definitely opt for the thicker veneer. But, more than that, I would seriously consider making a whole new top for that cabinet. The warping and cupping that you have there will be nearly impossible to correct.



Yes we are planning on making a new top. Which begs the question..... can i just buy an old piece of quarter sawn oak furniture and use it for the top? Or should I go with the veneer?

We may also have to remake the bottom piece as well. It’s going to be a lot of work! ;)

David


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 1:12 pm 
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Victor VI
Joined: Mon Aug 24, 2009 3:08 pm
Posts: 3257
Location: Harrison Township, MI
dzavracky wrote:
JerryVan wrote:
David,

I would definitely opt for the thicker veneer. But, more than that, I would seriously consider making a whole new top for that cabinet. The warping and cupping that you have there will be nearly impossible to correct.



Yes we are planning on making a new top. Which begs the question..... can i just buy an old piece of quarter sawn oak furniture and use it for the top? Or should I go with the veneer?

We may also have to remake the bottom piece as well. It’s going to be a lot of work! ;)

David


Yes, you could go the donor piece of furniture route! I like it when that's possible, since the wood will already have look of age. The donor piece doesn't necessarily have to be solid, quartered oak. It's okay if the wood from the old piece of furniture is veneered, so long as it's in good condition. Just be VERY careful when cutting it and routing the edge so you don't chip off a hunk of veneer! Really though, even a totally new top doesn't have to be veneered. You could go with solid, quartered oak and would probably be better off doing so in the long run. As cool and collectible as these cabinets are, they were made extremely cheap. My father repaired several and was surprised at the sometimes shoddy construction of them. A solid top would be an upgrade!


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 2:14 pm 
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Victor III
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college collector
Joined: Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:37 pm
Posts: 735
Location: Knoxville Tennessee
JerryVan wrote:
dzavracky wrote:
JerryVan wrote:
David,

I would definitely opt for the thicker veneer. But, more than that, I would seriously consider making a whole new top for that cabinet. The warping and cupping that you have there will be nearly impossible to correct.



Yes we are planning on making a new top. Which begs the question..... can i just buy an old piece of quarter sawn oak furniture and use it for the top? Or should I go with the veneer?

We may also have to remake the bottom piece as well. It’s going to be a lot of work! ;)

David


Yes, you could go the donor piece of furniture route! I like it when that's possible, since the wood will already have look of age. The donor piece doesn't necessarily have to be solid, quartered oak. It's okay if the wood from the old piece of furniture is veneered, so long as it's in good condition. Just be VERY careful when cutting it and routing the edge so you don't chip off a hunk of veneer! Really though, even a totally new top doesn't have to be veneered. You could go with solid, quartered oak and would probably be better off doing so in the long run. As cool and collectible as these cabinets are, they were made extremely cheap. My father repaired several and was surprised at the sometimes shoddy construction of them. A solid top would be an upgrade!



Okay. Not only will that route be less expensive, but I agree that it may look better in the end. Now to start looking around for a donor piece of furniture :lol:

I will be saving the old top of course, and some it it will go towards repairing the broken part of the base of the cabinet.

I am super excited to be moving forward after months of stripping the paint :? . It was so tedious :roll:


More updates to come soon!

David


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 7:32 pm 
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Victor Monarch
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Needle Tins are Addictive
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2010 8:32 pm
Posts: 4995
Location: Belmont, North Carolina
David, I posted the contact info of a place that sells quartersawn solid oak boards in an earlier section of this thread:
Here is what I posted:
"David, as an alternative to using antique furniture, the best option for the top is solid 4/4 (1" thick) quartersawn prime boards. You would cut them to the approximate length of the top and glue them edge to edge to the desired width of the top, then using the original top as a pattern, cut out a new top and finish the edges with a router. Don't use veneer on the top, since the edges are visible and won''t appear to be the same. Spend some time researching this, since the cabinet will be either (1) desirable or (2) not desirable, depending on how it's restored. There are lumber yards that supply millwork to upscale furniture manufacturers or cabinet companies that you can order prime lumber from."

Here is a place in Ohio that carries prime 4/4 quartersawn white oak boards: http://www.yoderlumber.com/images/pdfs/ ... celist.pdf
Call them and see what is available... then plan it out. It will be worth your time to do this correctly, not just glue the old mess back together.

"The grain of quarter sawn white oak includes decorative effects such as ray flecks, interlocking, and wavy “ribbon” patterns, which are often featured in fine furniture and cabinetry. Quarter Sawn boards are also more stable and are less likely to cup or shrink."

Using new wood might be easier than trying to locate a donor piece of furniture, although if you can find one, it would be the appropriate age to match your cabinet.
"The phonograph† is not of any commercial value."
Thomas Alva Edison - Comment to his assistant, Samuel Insull.

"No one needs a Victrola XX, a Perfected Graphophone Type G, or whatever you call those noisy things."
My Wife


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 8:06 pm 
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Victor III
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college collector
Joined: Fri Oct 25, 2019 11:37 pm
Posts: 735
Location: Knoxville Tennessee
Curt A wrote:
David, I posted the contact info of a place that sells quartersawn solid oak boards in an earlier section of this thread:
Here is what I posted:
"David, as an alternative to using antique furniture, the best option for the top is solid 4/4 (1" thick) quartersawn prime boards. You would cut them to the approximate length of the top and glue them edge to edge to the desired width of the top, then using the original top as a pattern, cut out a new top and finish the edges with a router. Don't use veneer on the top, since the edges are visible and won''t appear to be the same. Spend some time researching this, since the cabinet will be either (1) desirable or (2) not desirable, depending on how it's restored. There are lumber yards that supply millwork to upscale furniture manufacturers or cabinet companies that you can order prime lumber from."

Here is a place in Ohio that carries prime 4/4 quartersawn white oak boards: http://www.yoderlumber.com/images/pdfs/ ... celist.pdf
Call them and see what is available... then plan it out. It will be worth your time to do this correctly, not just glue the old mess back together.

"The grain of quarter sawn white oak includes decorative effects such as ray flecks, interlocking, and wavy “ribbon” patterns, which are often featured in fine furniture and cabinetry. Quarter Sawn boards are also more stable and are less likely to cup or shrink."

Using new wood might be easier than trying to locate a donor piece of furniture, although if you can find one, it would be the appropriate age to match your cabinet.


Hey Curt,

I had forgotten that you posted that. I will look into that! I actually haven't had any luck finding a donor cabinet anyways.

David


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sat Nov 21, 2020 10:21 pm 
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Victor Monarch
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Needle Tins are Addictive
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2010 8:32 pm
Posts: 4995
Location: Belmont, North Carolina
Here is the page of wood species that they carry... when you inquire, make sure you check on quartersawn white oak, not red oak.
https://yoderlumber.com/wood-species/

Good luck, your restoration is going well...
"The phonograph† is not of any commercial value."
Thomas Alva Edison - Comment to his assistant, Samuel Insull.

"No one needs a Victrola XX, a Perfected Graphophone Type G, or whatever you call those noisy things."
My Wife


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 Post subject: Re: Herzog full barrel restoration
PostPosted: Sun Nov 22, 2020 12:13 pm 
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Victor IV
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Those who were seen dancing were thought insane by those who could not hear the music. Nietzsche
Joined: Wed Jun 13, 2012 1:55 am
Posts: 1848
Location: Tucson, AZ
You are doing an awesome job on that cabinet.
Keep up the good work.

James.


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