Help needed with Victrola XI-A motor

[soundgen]

"And Soundgen, without your help today I have big doubts that the cause of this problem would have been solved. A BIG thank you! A big thank you also to everyone else who also did their best in trying to help me with this problem. I am very grateful for your posts !"

Invoice on the way !

[alang]

I have been able to test the function with the disabled speed indicator mechanism.

I had HMV 109 in my garage room, and got an idea to remove the motorboard of the 109,
and throw in the motorboard of the Victrola XI-A, since quick measures showed that the
motorboard sizes were not too different:;)

Here is the result: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Oknwz-6 ... e=youtu.be

And Soundgen, without your help today I have big doubts that the cause of this problem would have been solved. A BIG thank you! A big thank you also to everyone else who also did their best in trying to help me with this problem. I am very grateful for your posts !

I would possibly at one stage have tried to remove the pad, since this also was my initial idea, but I would never have understood why it was bringing too much friction to the plate.
I also realize that the first intuitive response one get to a problem, often is correct,
my initial feeling (and saying in the first post), was that this to me unknown brake pad was slowing the governor. I would however never have blamed this small spring, I have not enough knowledge and past experience to realize that this was the problem. The fact that the machine has worked in my garage room during the past 2 months is also a mystery, but as you (Soundgen) said..the transportation must have awaken the problem and somehow allowed this oversized hair spring to disturb the governor plage to the maximum effect. I had this gramophone only for one year, and I know that it before I got the last 20-30 years had been stored in a gazebo without being used. Still, sometime in the remote past a repair must have been done to the gramophone, where this spring has been changed.
This was actually a very good day for learning, no doubt !

Just a thought, maybe you had oiled that speed indicator pad and with a lot of oil the friction was not enough to slow it down. After a year some of the oil may have disappeared, thus more friction? I am not sure if you will be able to find a replacement spring alone, but
the whole assembly should be relatively easy to find on US eBay or from someone like George Vollema.

Glad you were able to find the problem.
Andreas

[nostalgia]

The gramophone motor was oiled two months ago, when I put the final touch on the machine, after starting the restoration last year. And I have played on the gramophone several times in my garage room during the last few weeks. I guess it will remain a mystery why the brakepad suddenly had such a big impact on the speed after the transportation, in particular because I know the speed indicator mechanism was working well just a small week ago. What I however already felt when starting this thread, was that the pad kept a too hard pressure on the governor plate, but I had no idea at all that the actual hair spring was too big. Thanks to Soundgen, this problem was resolved. I understood from his post that he also was very sure this was the problem, even offering to cover my petrol expenses if this fix did not work...hehe.
I think I will just allow the machine to work as it is now, and the speed can easily be adjusted with a stroboscope too if needed. But thanks your your suggestion, Andreas.
And Soundgen, I guess I should start saving up for your invoice;)

[JerryVan]

Although it may be the wrong spring, it may still be able to work. You can adjust the pressure that the hairspring exerts, by loosening the small screw on the side of arm that the friction pad is mounted to. At the same time you loosen the screw, hold the small knurled shaft, protruding from the top of the speed indicator assembly, and with the screw loose, rotate that shaft in such a direction as to "unwind" the hairspring a bit. Then tighten the screw and try it out. May take a few attempts. Basically, you only need enough spring tension to actuate the indicator mechanism, and no more. Even with the correct hairspring, improper adjustment can bring the motor to a stop.

[nostalgia]

Thank you, Jerry. I was looking at the small screws when I disabled the mechanism. This is a very small mechanism, tiny screws etc.
If I decide to leave this motor as it is now, your advice will still be valuable information for future restorations.