Peter Pan Gramophone

[Armando]

Hi Guys, While acquiring an Victor AA50 today I came across a Peter Pan Gramophone, is anyone familiar with this machine? Thanks, Armando

[gramophoneshane]

yes, there's 3 or 4 versions of it, including one with a built in clock. The earliest had a collapsible aluminium horn, and later a tonearm was mounted in the lid, and the lid became the horn. I think they were introduced in 1922/23 if my memory serves correct.
The running gear was supplied by Thorens, and the small motor was common to many other portable and camera type models, so parts are easily found.

[Armando]

Hi Gramophoneshane,

Right you are, this one had the collapsable horn that was intergrated in the lid, interesting. Was Thorens a manufacturer of works alone or did they produce complete gramophones ?

Thanks, Armando

yes, there's 3 or 4 versions of it, including one with a built in clock. The earliest had a collapsible aluminium horn, and later a tonearm was mounted in the lid, and the lid became the horn. I think they were introduced in 1922/23 if my memory serves correct.
The running gear was supplied by Thorens, and the small motor was common to many other portable and camera type models, so parts are easily found.

[gramophoneshane]

Thorens sold complete machines in their own name, and also supplied complete machines badged for different outside companies, as well as supplying parts to anyone who wanted them.
Thorens supplied complete external horn machines branded as Rexophone to Jackson & McDonald Co, here in Australia, and then started supplying the running gear only when J&M started manufacturing internal horn Rexonolas in 1912.
Another example is a Regal portable I have. It carries a decal "Regal- made in Australia" across the front, and I assume these were first offered here around the same as Columbia/Regal opened their studio & pressing plant in Sydney in late 1926.
However, exactly the same model was offered in the 1922 Edison-Bell catalogue in England, so it appears both Columbia/Regal & Edison-Bell bought the complete machines from Thorens. Both machines use the same soundbox, but have a paper label behind the mica with the Regal & Edison-Bell names on them, so it would seem both machines were branded at the Thorens factory, and not once they'd reached their destination.
Excelda camera type portables are another example of a Thorens made machine that can be branded with their own name, or the name of the outside company that sold them.
Their early machines seldom carry the Thorens name on them, which can make them hard to identify, but most will have the anchor trademark printed on the paper behind the mica diaphragm.
Unfortunately, the anchor also appears on many "branded" soundboxes too, so although it indicates the soundbox was manufactured by Thorens, it doesn't neccesarily mean the whole machine was sold under the Thorens name.

[Armando]

Thanks Shane, You have been very helpful ! How long have you been collecting ? Your knowledge seems extensive. Armando

Thorens sold complete machines in their own name, and also supplied complete machines badged for different outside companies, as well as supplying parts to anyone who wanted them.
Thorens supplied complete external horn machines branded as Rexophone to Jackson & McDonald Co, here in Australia, and then started supplying the running gear only when J&M started manufacturing internal horn Rexonolas in 1912.
Another example is a Regal portable I have. It carries a decal "Regal- made in Australia" across the front, and I assume these were first offered here around the same as Columbia/Regal opened their studio & pressing plant in Sydney in late 1926.
However, exactly the same model was offered in the 1922 Edison-Bell catalogue in England, so it appears both Columbia/Regal & Edison-Bell bought the complete machines from Thorens. Both machines use the same soundbox, but have a paper label behind the mica with the Regal & Edison-Bell names on them, so it would seem both machines were branded at the Thorens factory, and not once they'd reached their destination.
Excelda camera type portables are another example of a Thorens made machine that can be branded with their own name, or the name of the outside company that sold them.
Their early machines seldom carry the Thorens name on them, which can make them hard to identify, but most will have the anchor trademark printed on the paper behind the mica diaphragm.
Unfortunately, the anchor also appears on many "branded" soundboxes too, so although it indicates the soundbox was manufactured by Thorens, it doesn't neccesarily mean the whole machine was sold under the Thorens name.

[gramophoneshane]

I've been collecting for almost 32 yrs, but I know next to nothing compared to a lot of the guys here.
Up until 4 yrs ago when I got my first computer, I had one book (Collecting phonographs & Gramophones by Christopher Proudfoot) which I bought in 1980, and I spoke to a couple local collectors briefly about once a year.
It wasn't until I came across these forums (and learned how to google), that my knowledge started to expand, thanks to the generousity of other members who give far more than they get in return.
What I know about Edison's is minimal, and I know nothing about Victor and most other American machines, but I guess I might have a slight advantage when it comes to Thorens.
Nobody ever manufactured motors here in Australia, so 99% of the machines made here used motors by Thorens, Paillard or Garrard.
The majority of our imported machines came from England too, and Garrard & Thorens motors are used in many of those as well.
So, when you're face with so many "Swissies", you dont have much choice but to find out what you can about the companies that made them

[Armando]

Hi Shane, Thanks for the background, Good chatting, Armando