Anchors Aweigh!!- or, follow-up on 9-55 restoration

[schweg]

I mentioned yesterday an interesting communication I had with a radio restorer whom I hoped could restore into working condition several radio/phonographs, including the 9-55 I posted last evening.

I asked about several models I've had sitting in silence, plus 2 that I will retrieve in Jan when I go to FL for my annual 1) visit to parents, 2) Orlando phono show, 3) pick-up stuff my patient and wonderful parents haul down from NJ for me.

I asked about the 9-55, the ornate RE-45 in the Alonzi cabinet I posted last month: http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... dio#p24463

A Stromberg Carlson Art Model 846 I showed in March- http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... rg&start=0

Finally, the two in FL, to be picked up in Jan. include: an Edison C-4 radio/phono combination- it's pictured in some brochures here (Thanks Bruce)- http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... 71&start=0. I've only seen pics of the one I got but knew the later Edison's were rare so grabbed it off Craiglist in PA and had my Dad pick it up and haul it to FL to await my visit.

The second one in FL is a typical RE-45 that I really don't know anything about. The CL seller who had the Edison said he'd throw it in if I wanted it for a low price (at least I thought it was- but read on) so I went ahead and got it without any idea what kind of shape it's in mechanically.


Sooo, here's the response, I posted it in it's entirety although it is a bit long it's worth reading the whole thing..

Hello!

Those are called "boat anchors" by radio collectors. They are more of a
"niche" collector item than something that is valuable. You have to have
a lot of space to collect those big things! (I only have one very high
end one in my collection) I have personally demolished at least 5 re45
type panatrope-radios and helped an antique dealer with a load of twelve
more. (I get far more for the parts than I do for a complete panatrope!)
We worked all one Saturday afternoon pulling chassis, phonos, speakers,
and other parts and then took sledge hammers to the cabinets. I admit
they were some really ornate cabinets but they have a selling value of
about $25 in today's market. You are the only person I now know of that
collects those things! We did luck out on getting rid of the cabinet
wood! An old guy pulled up in a pickup truck and said he was a
woodworker and he loaded up all the broken up wood into his truck and
hauled it away! (the truck was bottomed out when he was done loading!)
As for the repair, I can do it but I don't know the exact time frame
that I can get to them. The end of the year is busy for me..The cost
will be between $300 and $500 per radio, the higher being for the one
that has the unmatched chassis. I have a certain number of parts for
those chassis but don't keep much since I don't normally work on them,
so if I don't have the parts I would have to improvise, which increases
the cost.
I sure wish I had known your phone number about 7 years ago when we were
ripping up all those panatropes! Would have given you the lot for a
promise to haul them all away!


Silly me! What was I thinking? OK, fellow collectors of boat anchors. I think it's time we had a sledgehammer party followed by a bonfire!!

Steve

[gramophoneshane]

lol, radio collectors/repairers are a funny breed I reckon. If it's not a mantle model, it's a boat anchor worthy of the sledge hammer
I do know that unless you can do the repairs yourself, these things are expensive to have fixed. A basic restoration (recap, replace a few daggy wires etc) will seldom be less than $200- here anyway, and even if it's a worthless 1960s model.
Even if the radio is still working, it'll cost you that much, because the caps HAVE to be done, otherwise they can explode, cause fires, or burn out more expensive components like transformers. Add to the cost a tube or two, a speaker repair etc, and you can easily spend $400-500 getting them going.
This is the main reason I try & keep away from the early electric radios/radiograms. (if you can call about 8 radios & 8 radiograms keeping away )
I pick up my Aeoleon push-up piano player on the weekend, at a cost of $2000 , then my next projects are my rare Rexonola radiogram, followed by a rare highend Beale. I sure hope I dont run into a repairman with the same attitude as your repairman has!

[Valecnik]

It is truly sad that there's not more value placed on those things.

I bought my Stromberg Carlson, a true technological wonder in 1923, for $125 needing a rebuild, several years ago. Pictured here. http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... erg#p18431


I found a good technician who could do the job including building me a power supply for about $200 if I recall correctly. He warned me in advance that in spite of his rebuild the radio would not be worth more than $150 tops, that is IF I COULD find anywone who would even want it!

Needless to say I told him to go ahead with the rebuild anyway

The Same guy rebuilt my Edisons C2, C4, R5 & R6 and a fancy floor model Apex. None of them was a money making proposition for me but I enjoyed having them and eventually, except for the Stromberg Carlson, passed them on to others who I hope are enjoying them today...

[Kirkwood]

Well, we can't save them all. Nobody knows what the condition was on these sets that got "chopped up" and yeah, the parts we need have to come from someplace. Are you sure he wasn't just yanking your chain with this story? Seems like even among collectors that disdain the "boat anchor" monster sets, they know enough to keep the really good ones intact.

Admittedly, restoring the electrical components can run into money. I'll admit to spending more in time and parts than a phono is worth----at least, right at the moment. Maybe it will be worth more someday, and I can recover my "investment" or more likely it won't. My enjoyment is the reward. Saving a fine piece of early technology is worthwhile. And as for the comment "nobody" collects the "boat anchors"-----that should be followed by "in this area" or "that I know of". There ARE more than one or two enthusiasts for the Panatropes & Electrolas.

[schweg]

Thanks to all for your comments and even for the slightly discussion on shipping one of these big fellas. I'll likely be hauling mine and all the rest of the menagerie, by U-haul in the next few yrs so the recommendations on what to remove were appreciated. I brought the collection, somewhat smaller at the time, from OK to TX in 2002 and it all went well.

Kirkwood, he may have been joking, I'm not sure. I figured that maybe he just didn't want to work on my projects although $200-300 X 5 isn't chump change. However, his response convinced me that I should go elsewhere. There is another place here locally that can help. I also had a guy in OK that helped me out previously and I'll be heading up there early next month so may try and contact him to see if he's willing. I can haul the parts w/o the cabinets pretty easily for at least 2 of them so may try that.

Steve

[estott]

It seems that there the interest in 20's and early 30's cabinet radios is about the same as the interest in 20's flat top consoles- even the best ones won't fetch much. The ones that do sell are the late 30's-40's Deco/Moderne cabinets, and that's mostly for the flashy cabinets.

[Phototone]

All my life (I am 59) I heard the term "Boat Anchor" only applied to communications receivers and transmitters, usually war surplus.

[Uncle Vanya]

I mentioned yesterday an interesting communication I had with a radio restorer whom I hoped could restore into working condition several radio/phonographs, including the 9-55 I posted last evening.

I asked about several models I've had sitting in silence, plus 2 that I will retrieve in Jan when I go to FL for my annual 1) visit to parents, 2) Orlando phono show, 3) pick-up stuff my patient and wonderful parents haul down from NJ for me.

I asked about the 9-55, the ornate RE-45 in the Alonzi cabinet I posted last month: http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... dio#p24463

A Stromberg Carlson Art Model 846 I showed in March- http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... rg&start=0

Finally, the two in FL, to be picked up in Jan. include: an Edison C-4 radio/phono combination- it's pictured in some brochures here (Thanks Bruce)- http://forum.talkingmachine.info/viewto ... 71&start=0. I've only seen pics of the one I got but knew the later Edison's were rare so grabbed it off Craiglist in PA and had my Dad pick it up and haul it to FL to await my visit.

The second one in FL is a typical RE-45 that I really don't know anything about. The CL seller who had the Edison said he'd throw it in if I wanted it for a low price (at least I thought it was- but read on) so I went ahead and got it without any idea what kind of shape it's in mechanically.


Sooo, here's the response, I posted it in it's entirety although it is a bit long it's worth reading the whole thing..

Hello!

Those are called "boat anchors" by radio collectors. They are more of a
"niche" collector item than something that is valuable. You have to have
a lot of space to collect those big things! (I only have one very high
end one in my collection) I have personally demolished at least 5 re45
type panatrope-radios and helped an antique dealer with a load of twelve
more. (I get far more for the parts than I do for a complete panatrope!)
We worked all one Saturday afternoon pulling chassis, phonos, speakers,
and other parts and then took sledge hammers to the cabinets. I admit
they were some really ornate cabinets but they have a selling value of
about $25 in today's market. You are the only person I now know of that
collects those things! We did luck out on getting rid of the cabinet
wood! An old guy pulled up in a pickup truck and said he was a
woodworker and he loaded up all the broken up wood into his truck and
hauled it away! (the truck was bottomed out when he was done loading!)
As for the repair, I can do it but I don't know the exact time frame
that I can get to them. The end of the year is busy for me..The cost
will be between $300 and $500 per radio, the higher being for the one
that has the unmatched chassis. I have a certain number of parts for
those chassis but don't keep much since I don't normally work on them,
so if I don't have the parts I would have to improvise, which increases
the cost.
I sure wish I had known your phone number about 7 years ago when we were
ripping up all those panatropes! Would have given you the lot for a
promise to haul them all away!


Silly me! What was I thinking? OK, fellow collectors of boat anchors. I think it's time we had a sledgehammer party followed by a bonfire!!

Steve

Well, I've broken up a couple dozen RE-45, R-52 and R-32 sets over the years, BUT ONLY THOSE WITH BADLY DAMAGED CABINETS!

The repair of most of these sets is a fairly simple matter, generally. The Stromberg Carlson and the Victor Radio chassis used extremely high quality imported fish papers in their condensers. The filter, bypass and coupling condensers in these sets seldom fail. In most cases these sets require nothing more than the replacement of a few resistors to get them running in fine shape, with the caveat that the first several thousand of the Victor Micro-Synchronous radio amplifier chassis produced had weak power transformers, but most of the torublesome units were either repaired or scrapped seventy years since.

Collect what you like. Don't worry about other collector's carping. Note that I've picked up some pretty choice phonograph items cheaply at radio meets, including one Victor 9-56, because radio collectors DON'T LIKE PHONOGRAPHS! At last year's Lansing meet aI bought a really nice Pooley model 1500 radio/phonograph combination dating from 1925 for A DOLLAR. The (rather common) Atwater Kent Model 20C battery radio chassis and loudspeaker driver had been removed, but the set was otherwise complete, and in fine condition. I really had no use for this rare early combination, but could not bear to see it scrapped. I gave it to another phonograph collector, and am currently repairing an AK 20 chassis to put in the set.

[Skihawx]

I could use some photos of a 9-56! Especially how the wiring
harness is dressed and what the back looks like with vents and all.
Regards,

[Kirkwood]

All my life (I am 59) I heard the term "Boat Anchor" only applied to communications receivers and transmitters, usually war surplus.

I have to agree with Phototone, even though I quoted the term in my response above in conjunction with larger cabinet sets. Among the radio collectors I know, I think the term is usually meant cover utilitarian or war surplus type sets as Phototone said. Seems like I remember radio collector ads have a separate category called such. I guess the radio tech was trying to convey "big & heavy", which the chassis (with transformers) of many 20s-30s sets could be. I think he also conveyed that he didn't much care to deal with them either.