The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Here are two Victor back brackets. One is from a Victor IV (could have been a Victor III, M, or MS). The other bracket is from a Victor V (could have been from a Victor VI or D). You'll also notice the Victor IV bracket is in much better shape than the one for the V. That's when collectors, yes collectors, look at both brackets and install the better one on what they perceive as the more prestigious machine.

Please look at the top photo. On first inspection they look identical but they are not. Look at the next photos. The brackets are not the same. The small difference in size will cause increased record wear. So when inspecting a Victor always give it a spindle test,. The last photo shows that the needle should be very close to the spindle on a Victor with the correct bracket.

The same tonearm is used on all Victor III, IV, V, VI, M, MS, & D. Some may be gold plated and others nickel plated but it's the same arm. Cabinets for the III, IV, M, & MS are smaller than the cabinets for the V, VI, & D. So if the tonearms are the same and the cabinets are different sizes, the compensation is made in the size of the brackets. When you consider a Victor purchase please do the spindle check. As a collector wishing to upgrade a machine please check the size of any replacement back bracket.

Jerry Blais

I've noticed that some have the extra blue filigree. Is this tied to size or time period? I never looked at my machines for a pattern.

I spent a little time walking around the basement looking at back brackets today. The Victors III, IV, and V had blue highlights but VI did not. I've seen others comment on the highlights but never paid much attention. I suppose that's because so many back brackets get swapped by collectors. But you can't help but wonder why you wouldn't see blue highlights on a VI. The photos in my thread show blue highlights on the IV bracket but no highlights on the V bracket. ???

Jerry B.

I think the reason the VI just has gold and no blue, might be because Victor used gold leaf on those decals instead of gold paint. I might be wrong, but the VI I have looks more like metal than paint. I don't have much to compare things to around here, but there is that to think about. Greg Cline's decals show the same one for the V and VI, so maybe he knows something about how Victor did those.

Jerry, point well taken. I once had a later, post-humpback style Victor II, on which the needle overshot the spindle by at least ¼ inch. Needless to say, it's performance was terrible. It wasn't so much about record damage because I didn't use it very often, but because of the extreme overhang it tended to pop out of the locked groove at the end of the record, skate across the label to a point just past the spindle where it woulddig a ditch in the label. I didn't think of it at the time but I could have made a shim to go between the back bracket and the case which, although not technically correct, would have made it operate properly until correct parts could be found.

I own 2 Victor V machines. One, s/n 192XX has the blue striping on the back bracket, while the other, s/n 377XX does not. Other differences between the two include: 192XX has a slip on crank, a a pushbutton motorboard latch, originally had a flat plate crank escutcheon (lost in a move) and a round hole Exhibition. The other one has a female threaded crank, a crank escutcheon with a bushing push-down motorboard latch and a triangle hole Exhibition. Both machines have cast iron turntables and are otherwise the same. Both machines appear to be original with no apparent parts swaps except possiibly reproducers, although obviously no one can say for sure after all this time.

Jim