Input on this Unknown Off Brand Welcomed

[Granby]

Greetings -

My research into the Granby Phonograph and my interest in phonograph collecting has led me down some unique paths! Last week, I purchased this off brand with no markings or labels from an estate in Virginia which I think "may" have ties to the Granby Phonograph factory. It may be a long shot being that many off brand companies used common hardware such as tone arms, speed controls, turntables, etc. However, at the moment, I truly think this might be an early Granby or come from the same factory even thought it doesn't have the dome lid.

I won't launch into a complete history of the model line and bore everybody here.... But, early Granby phonographs did have traditional flat top lids similar to Brunswick and Aeolian phonographs. They shared cabinet features among different models, too.

So, my question is this: Are there any fellow collectors that have seen an off brand similar in cabinet style to this? Note the legs. Fellow forum member "emerson" mentioned Rishell as a possibility.... Does anybody have an off brand that is strikingly similar? No pressure, I am just following all leads as I try to find out if this may truly be an early unknown Granby.

Hey, it will be what it will be. I still like it even if it turns out not to be what I thought it was.... all part of the fun!!

[Curt A]

It has a tonearm of the type used by Rishell, but that type may have been used by other manufacturers, as well.
One thing for sure - it doesn't have the same type of dishes shown behind the grill of the Granby... that may have been an option.

[Inigo]

Ufff... The lid and the crank seem Vocalion, although the unique Vocalion brake is not present... Could you add some photos of the details under the lid? I mean the speed dial, the brake, that thing protruding behind the turntable at the back, etc...
The horn is wood or tinplate?

[Granby]

Ufff... The lid and the crank seem Vocalion, although the unique Vocalion brake is not present... Could you add some photos of the details under the lid? I mean the speed dial, the brake, that thing protruding behind the turntable at the back, etc...
The horn is wood or tinplate?

Yes, later today I will get a better view of under the lid.... The horn is wood. The thing near the tone arm is a volume control mechanism.... Thanks!!

[Inigo]

This could give a clue... Aeolian had the Graduola and the Volunome, both volume controls, but they coexisted in the same machine for the luxury models.
Some other brands followed the wave of so called 'tone controls' in the advertising literature, which were simple obstructions in the air passages, more or less cleverly engineered. But this detail narrows the search...
J R Wakeman write a book listing 263 US manufacturers of gramophones during the boom era (1916 to 1924 roughly) where you can find many names and some advertising. This book is online in the form of an article in Tim Gracyk's web (Tim is a member of this forum, let's hope he jumps in and give us some light).
See https://www.gracyk.com/makers.shtml
Other sites if you Google this.
This is also good https://www.antiquephono.org/brand-talk ... j-wakeman/
It's the same author and theme, but it could have different adverts...

[Granby]

Here are some more pictures... I think that many may see my true dilemma and reason for suspicion once they see these pictures side by side. I will clearly mark the photos so the real Granbys and the "unknown" off brand are identified.

My theory.... maybe I am in possession of an early unmarked Granby prototype??? If proved otherwise, I will be okay.... I promise...

Have fun!!

[Curt A]

I guess the tonearm I.D. is of no use, since Granby and Rishell and probably many others used that black tonearm...

[JerryVan]

If I'm seeing things correctly, it would be odd for your mystery machine to have a gold plated lid hinge when every other bit of plating is nickel. Is the hinge really gold plated, or a trick of lighting & photography?

Also, the lid prop being mounted so far inboard is odd, along with the makeshift looking dog-leg in the prop arm and mounting plate, at the lid end. I'm curious as well about the motor board. It appears as if the framing of the cabinet had to be "let out" a bit along the front and rear edges to accomodate the dimensions of the motor board. Perhaps that was intentional and part of an original design, but from a cabinet making point of view, it's odd.

Capture.JPG (43.02 KiB) Viewed 581 times

[Granby]

If I'm seeing things correctly, it would be odd for your mystery machine to have a gold plated lid hinge when every other bit of plating is nickel. Is the hinge really gold plated, or a trick of lighting & photography?

Also, the lid prop being mounted so far inboard is odd, along with the makeshift looking dog-leg in the prop arm and mounting plate, at the lid end. I'm curious as well about the motor board. It appears as if the framing of the cabinet had to be "let out" a bit along the front and rear edges to accomodate the dimensions of the motor board. Perhaps that was intentional and part of an original design, but from a cabinet making point of view, it's odd.

Capture.JPG

Thank you.... and I 100% agree. I thought that was a strange placement for the lid support AND I thought it was strange that it was connected to the same board as the motor assembly - I had to disconnect the lid support just to pull the motor assembly/board out.

And, you're right in that the lid hinge is a brass/gold finish. The only other brass/gold item is the "knob" on the sliding volume control.

It did cross my mind, briefly, that maybe this was the product of a creative person, made from other recycled phonograph parts. However, the age of all the parts and the finish of all the cabinet components seemed to have aged consistently.

[JerryVan]

If I'm seeing things correctly, it would be odd for your mystery machine to have a gold plated lid hinge when every other bit of plating is nickel. Is the hinge really gold plated, or a trick of lighting & photography?

Also, the lid prop being mounted so far inboard is odd, along with the makeshift looking dog-leg in the prop arm and mounting plate, at the lid end. I'm curious as well about the motor board. It appears as if the framing of the cabinet had to be "let out" a bit along the front and rear edges to accomodate the dimensions of the motor board. Perhaps that was intentional and part of an original design, but from a cabinet making point of view, it's odd.

Capture.JPG

Thank you.... and I 100% agree. I thought that was a strange placement for the lid support AND I thought it was strange that it was connected to the same board as the motor assembly - I had to disconnect the lid support just to pull the motor assembly/board out.

And, you're right in that the lid hinge is a brass/gold finish. The only other brass/gold item is the "knob" on the sliding volume control.

It did cross my mind, briefly, that maybe this was the product of a creative person, made from other recycled phonograph parts. However, the age of all the parts and the finish of all the cabinet components seemed to have aged consistently.

The "Granby console in my collection" photo shows a similarly placed lid prop. Needle cup locations also appear the same. Makes me wonder if the whole motor board wasn't "borrowed" from a console model and fit into the "mystery" cabinet?