Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

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Herderz
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Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Herderz »

I just picked up this machine for my next project. Victor VV IX that looks to be complete. It looks to have the original finish but I am not for sure. $100 and a 5 hour drive got it to may shop. It came with 47 disc's. I wound it up and it plays very good. I play several of the disc's it came with. The motor looks very clean compared to my other motor restores leading me to think someone has worked on it not to long ago. It has wear issues but nothing I cannot fix. It must of been in a damp environment at some point because the veneer is loose at several edges and the top base board has cracked which pulled the top veneer apart. The inside of the lid is missing the Victor decal and the veneer bubbled. I will be breaking it down to evaluate everything and make a plan to restore each part. If anybody can give me a rough manufacture date based on model and serial number I would appreciate it.
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52089
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by 52089 »

According to the Victor-Victrola site, your machine is from 1919.

http://www.victor-victrola.com/IX.htm

The IX is a common machine usually found in mahogany. It's quite unusual to see one in oak. Good luck restoring it!

Herderz
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Herderz »

Thanks 52089 for the date and the victor page. I know that it is not anything special except that I am choosing to bringing back to the life it had in the past.

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Jonsheff
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Jonsheff »

That is quite an undertaking, water damaged veneer can be a challenge but i am sure thats why you decided to fix it up, i have done the same myself. With all the veneer repair, a full tear down and sanding would be advised. I restored a 1918 oak model like yours (full tear down, sand and new clear coat) and it turned out stunning. I used a walnut dye that really made the oak grain pop. As for the veneer repair, i typically use a small putty knife to work titebond cold press veneer glue under the lifted areas and clamp, under the lid will be tough but not impossible. Setting up the clamping method takes most of the time, i use wood wrapped in aluminum foil (so glue doesnt stick) and thin sheet metal. Each repair needs a different clampimg setup. Flat repairs are easy (the doors) i use two pieces of laminated wood to sandwich the piece and lots of clamps. For the cracks in the top, i might fix the loose veneer and clamp till flat, sand then use filler mixed with the same dye (or stain) that will be used for the final color. Also mixing sanding dust (and stain/dye) with the filler helps blend it. Good luck, Jon S
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Herderz
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Herderz »

Thanks Jonsheff for all the suggestions, your machine looks beautiful and the stain is just what I am looking for with this restore. I did a Columbia in Golden Oak right before this project and think I want the Victor to have a little more reddish tint to the oak.

Herderz
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Herderz »

I broke down the case to start on the veneer regluing. It will be a long process because pretty must all the edges have come loose about a inch or so.
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I am not going to show all the repairs but just give you guys a taste of what I am looking at.
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I used toothpicks to open up the veneer from the base and used a glue syringe to apply the glue in the crack, then a pallet knife to work the glue down into the base before clamping.
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I slowly started the clamping process to be able to wipe the excess glue off as I tightened the clamps with wet Q-tips and a wet cotton cloth. I did not want any glue to dry on my veneer surface because that would make problems when staining the veneer later.
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After 3 weeks of slowly going around each edge I finally got the glue job done. Then I hand sanded all the pieces with 220 to remove the stain base. The machine has been refinished at some point and the veneer was paper thin in spots.
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I decided to stain the machine in Golden Mahogany stain as I think this will give me my desired tint that I want the machine to have. It looks very much like the tint of the wood when I started. We will see how that comes out.
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I am still deciding on what to finish it in. The Columbia I put 10 coats of shellac using #0000 wool between coats. It was a lot of work and I am not sure I want this one to look like the last out come. I am thinking of a more satin finish. I just got the pieces setting on each other as I ponder what to do next.
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Jonsheff
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Jonsheff »

I use Mohawk Buffcote satin lacquer with a couple coats of Mohawk Vinyl sealer first. I have a Fuji spray rig. Minwax satin lacquer in a rattle can would be my choice if no spray rig, pretty sure its nitro lacquer.
I dont refinish with shellac for several reasons, first, as you already know it takes a lot of coats and a lot of sanding. I restore to resell, if did it that way i would certainly lose money. Second reason is that shellac is a fragile clear coat and doesnt hold up well unless cared for. Most Victrolas i see have black, alligatored shellac or in some cases where a wrong cleaner was used, the clear coat is missing in some areas. I want my restored phonographs to still look great in 100 years and with nitro lacquer, i believe they will. It would be difficult to tell the difference between nitro and shellac clear coats and besides, i havent had any complaints from buyers, only complements. I dont restore super rare phonographs like VTLA and the like since stripping and refinishing them would be a crime in my opinion.
Your doing a great job, its coming out great.

Herderz
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Herderz »

Thanks Jonsheff, I see you are a clockman also. That is also one of my many love's. I have never been into resell as an main objective, more like the rescue of neglected pieces of history and if you want to adopt one of my pieces we can work with that.

Herderz
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Herderz »

I decided to do my VV IX cabinet with satin lacquer. I put 4 coats of lacquer using #0000 wool between coats. I like how it can out and started to reassemble the pieces. I polished the door knobs and hinges along with the winding grommet. Then the lid hinge and screws. The challenges of the veneer problems paid off to my liking based on what I had to work with.
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I cleaned the horn up getting all the oil and grease droppings off and cleaned the wood louvers and bee's waxed them.
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After installing the horn I worked on the bottom plate of the cabinet. I was broke on one side and had warpage from being damp. I thought for just a bit about replacing the panels but hey a little glue to the break and it would be original. I glued it back together and put a couple more nails in it to sure it up even with the curves.
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I polished the tonearm mount rather then refinishing it because it still had the gold pin stripe present. Mounted the name plate and the needle cup holder.
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Inigo
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Re: Victor Talking Machine VV IX and info on the restoration

Post by Inigo »

Nice, it looks great... Thanks for sharing this instructive process.
Inigo

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