564586 Berliner Recording Gramophone

Discussion of patents relevant to the music and machines addressed by this forum.
Post Reply
JohnM
Victor V
Posts: 2852
Joined: Fri Jan 09, 2009 2:47 am
Location: Jerome, Arizona
Contact:

564586 Berliner Recording Gramophone

Post by JohnM »

Glass turntable
B8003FE9-AEA3-4D97-AE71-D7F9317A5F87.jpeg
Attachments
8FAA5A91-2063-4106-9D06-5FFDF64A3AB8.jpeg
"All of us have a place in history. Mine is clouds." Richard Brautigan

User avatar
Inigo
Victor V
Posts: 2795
Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2017 1:51 am
Personal Text: Keep'em well oiled
Location: Madrid, Spain
Contact:

Re: 564586 Berliner Recording Gramophone

Post by Inigo »

As a fast silly thought... Would a record made with this machine sound in reverse....? :D :D
Inigo

Menophanes
Victor II
Posts: 412
Joined: Thu Apr 27, 2017 5:52 am
Location: Redruth, Cornwall, U.K.

Re: 564586 Berliner Recording Gramophone

Post by Menophanes »

Am I right in understanding that the ink-coated recording blank was mounted under the turntable and was recorded on its lower side? Certainly the drawing is clear in showing the claw-shaped stylus (no. 29) pointing upwards.

The governor seems to be of the 'fly' or air-resistance type, as used for hundreds of years in the striking mechanisms of clocks.

The recording horn surely cannot have been as tiny as it appears here; it must have been compressed in order to fit it into the drawing.

Was this model ever actually used? The new wax-cutting process would in any event have rendered it obsolete within four years.

Oliver Mundy.

User avatar
Lucius1958
Victor VI
Posts: 3834
Joined: Tue Dec 14, 2010 12:17 am
Location: Where there's "hamburger ALL OVER the highway"...

Re: 564586 Berliner Recording Gramophone

Post by Lucius1958 »

Menophanes wrote: Sun Mar 13, 2022 5:21 am Am I right in understanding that the ink-coated recording blank was mounted under the turntable and was recorded on its lower side? Certainly the drawing is clear in showing the claw-shaped stylus (no. 29) pointing upwards.

The governor seems to be of the 'fly' or air-resistance type, as used for hundreds of years in the striking mechanisms of clocks.

The recording horn surely cannot have been as tiny as it appears here; it must have been compressed in order to fit it into the drawing.

Was this model ever actually used? The new wax-cutting process would in any event have rendered it obsolete within four years.

Oliver Mundy.
This was Berliner's original 1887 design, soon superseded by his adoption of acid-etched zinc discs; it was certainly obsolete by the time the patent was granted.

The speaking tube probably would have been much longer; but the mouthpiece is about the size he would have used.

I suppose the inverted stylus was to allow the ink 'swarf' to fall away from the glass disc (shown fixed directly to the machine, without a separate turntable) without having to brush it off.

- Bill

recordmaker
Victor I
Posts: 114
Joined: Mon Mar 25, 2019 11:50 am

Re: 564586 Berliner Recording Gramophone

Post by recordmaker »

Yes to what Bill said re the recording and "swarf" falling off .
Re small horn
Also Fred Gaisberg mentions his first visit to Berliner and the singer ( possibly Bert Shepherd ) with a "muzzel" on his face and the shape of the horn on this one is quite suggestive of that sort of device .
Re hand power
Fred writes that "Berliner shouted go! and began to crank like a barrel organ", suggesting a hand powered device was used for this and the first etched zinc process that I assume Fred was working with at his first visit.
Re Obsolete process
There is a possibility that pushing this (then obsolete) patent through was to maintain a priority in the USA for disc recording, note the British patent was granted earlier ( 1887 ) as quoted in the document.

Post Reply