The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 1:42 pm 
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Victor V
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:54 pm
Posts: 2905
phonosandradios wrote:
Whilst it is strange to hear the familiar arrangements in hi-fi and stereo it does really bring them to life.


There are two Glen Miller movies that were recorded in stereo. Both are available in full on YouTube.

Orchestra Wives
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K9TXTizrMBE

Sun Valley Serenade:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JGs6AvrXGG8

Hearing Kalamazoo and Chattanooga Choo Choo in real stereo from the 1940s is pretty amazing!


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:01 pm 
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Victor I
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So many audio formats, so little listening time!
Joined: Fri Oct 11, 2019 4:49 pm
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Location: Wiltshire, UK
Interesting. I've been aware of these films but not actually seen them before. Having a quick look were these actually recorded in stereo at the time or reprocessed to simulate stereo? I had a quick look through the comments of each video to see if this question had been asked and answered but it didn't appear to of been. But no matter how it was achieved the sound on these is very nice to listen to.
I am interested in all forms of audio media including: gramophones, phonographs, wire recorders, the tefifon, reel to reel tapes, radiograms and radios.


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 2:55 pm 
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Victor III
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Keep'em well oiled
Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:51 am
Posts: 749
Location: Madrid, Spain
Thanks for that one!
(And we're still so lucky to be able to buy a big bunch of glen miller original 78s for a couple bucks each....!)
Inigo


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:20 pm 
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Victor V
Joined: Mon Oct 03, 2011 7:54 pm
Posts: 2905
phonosandradios wrote:
Interesting. I've been aware of these films but not actually seen them before. Having a quick look were these actually recorded in stereo at the time or reprocessed to simulate stereo? I had a quick look through the comments of each video to see if this question had been asked and answered but it didn't appear to of been. But no matter how it was achieved the sound on these is very nice to listen to.


They are recorded in true stereo. Apparently virtually all Fox movies starting around 1937 were actually recorded with multiple microphones. There's not a lot on the web about this, but it's worth a search. I have the laserdisc of these two titles and can confirm that they are in full stereo in that format, though apparently not on VHS or DVD for some reason.


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 7:56 pm 
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Victor IV
Joined: Sun Mar 15, 2009 6:18 am
Posts: 1033
52089 wrote:

They are recorded in true stereo. Apparently virtually all Fox movies starting around 1937 were actually recorded with multiple microphones. There's not a lot on the web about this, but it's worth a search. I have the laserdisc of these two titles and can confirm that they are in full stereo in that format, though apparently not on VHS or DVD for some reason.


The stereo soundtrack was issued on a CD about 20 years ago, together with some outtakes that did nor make the final cut - it was recorded with at least two microphones. There is another early stereo record issued on CD, it is the medley that Duke Ellington recorded for Victor in the early 30's. The session was recorded with two microphones located far from each other, and for a long time the two recordings were thought to be different versions, until they were sychronized and found out to be the same record. It is quite interesting, as Cootie Williams moves from one side to the other of the studio while playing.


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Sun Nov 10, 2019 11:05 pm 
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Victor II
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Joined: Tue May 27, 2014 12:24 pm
Posts: 462
Inigo wrote:
... just listening to Tuxedo Junction...


That was my mother's favorite record. :cry:

I think others have brought forward the right idea: it's not so much that folks "hate" big band as that they are sick of turning up hundreds of copies of the same records every time they find a box of 78s. I used to feel the same way about Artur Rubinstein's '40s vintage sets of the Rachmaninoff 2d and Grieg Piano Concerti--every time I found a bunch of records, I could count on it, there would be another copy of one of those sets (or, frequently, both), and I'd just do one of these numbers: :roll: .

Be patient, folks--the generation that bought, and then squirreled away, all those Glenn Miller and Tommy Dorsey records is fast leaving us, and as it does so, too, will the records. It's a pure matter of demographics--I'm told the same thing happened, to a lesser degree, with scroll label Victors and contemporary pressings before the flood of big band--and in fact I think it's already well underway; I feel as if I'm not seeing nearly as many big band disks as I did, say, 15 years ago.

Oh, and for the, uh, record: while overwhelmingly a classical/opera listener and not in any way fixated on them, I like the better examples of big band just fine, and given my choice I tend to favor Artie Shaw (especially with his Gramercy Five, assuming that counts as "big band" and not some variant of "jazz") and Benny Goodman over, say, Glenn Miller and Tommy Dorsey. And I'm not even that big a fan of the clarinet!


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Mon Nov 11, 2019 10:07 pm 
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Victor V
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Posts: 2504
Location: NW Indiana B-19;VV-IV; VV-VI;VV-XVI; Edison Home B; Amberola 30; Col. BK; Magnola;
I have played these 1940’s big band records with the Soft tone or extra soft tone needed and they sound fine. I also play them on my Victor VV-XVI with the extra soft tone needles and the Victrola No. 4 soundbox (reproducer), and they sound amazing, almost like a regular old electric phonograph from the 1940’s. While these record were not said to be designed for the acoustic style phonographs, there were still many people using these machines to play these later issued 78’s. The steel needle was still used in many of the 1940’s era phonographs, and some of the arms were about as heavy as a reproducer on a talking machine.

The key to this is 1940’s record made of vinylite and plastic should not be played on a talking machine. Records made in the 1950’s should be ruled out, especially those by Capital, RCA Victor, Topps, Decca and others. When playing a 1940’s big band records, it comes down to a softer tone needle and a properly rebuilt reproducer such as a Victrola No. 4 or Orthophonic.


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:27 am 
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Victor V
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:55 am
Posts: 2723
Location: Eugene/ Springfield Oregon USA
AmberolaAndy wrote:
Sure you can’t play records from the 1940s on a acoustic machine,




Oops :oops: :?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edO--9k ... e=youtu.be
"He who dies with the most shellac wins"- some nutty record geek


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 1:28 am 
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Victor V
Joined: Tue Jan 21, 2014 12:55 am
Posts: 2723
Location: Eugene/ Springfield Oregon USA
AmberolaAndy wrote:
Sure you can’t play records from the 1940s on a acoustic machine,




Oops :oops: :?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edO--9k ... e=youtu.be

RCA Victor 20-1866, 1947 :)
"He who dies with the most shellac wins"- some nutty record geek


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 Post subject: Re: Why do record collectors hate Big Band music?
PostPosted: Thu Nov 21, 2019 3:33 am 
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Victor III
Joined: Fri May 26, 2017 10:15 pm
Posts: 698
Location: The one and only member near Omaha, Nebraska
gramophone-georg wrote:
AmberolaAndy wrote:
Sure you can’t play records from the 1940s on a acoustic machine,




Oops :oops: :?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=edO--9k ... e=youtu.be

RCA Victor 20-1866, 1947 :)


At least you didn’t play a record from the 60s on it... :?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eRO7oXXEVM8


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