Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

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Player-Tone
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Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by Player-Tone »

This thread will discuss the poor tracking of the Victrola No.2 sound-box and explain how to improve it by making a custom flange gasket:

-For a lateral reproducer to perform at its best the diaphragm must be parallel to the groove's tangent plane where the needle touches. If a reproducer is not parallel then part of the groove's lateral movement will be transferd against the needlebar piviot causing pressure, record wear, and lost performance. On a normal tone arm the Victrola No.2 is 12 degrees off from being parallel. This angle changes as the arm swings over the record, but that change is miniscule. To correct this the reproducer must be turned 12 degrees to line up with the tangent plane, which can easily be done with a custom flange gasket.

A flange gasket that is angled at 12 degrees will shift the reproducer enough to align parallel with the tangent plane while at the same time maintain clearence to fold back when not in use. Note that the needle is still 60 degrees in relation to the record, the gasket only rotates the reproducer's angle.

I made my flange gasket by first chipping the old rubber off an original brass flange. I then made a paper mold that allowed for the 12 degree angle, which I built around the brass ring (see picture). Following this I filled the mold with dark grey silicone, and let it cure for 24 hours. After it cured I installed it, confirmed everything fit properly, and finished the reproducer.

The new flange gasket allows the Victrola No.2 to track properly. I have noticed a reduction in record wear and a slight improvement in sound since installing this flange gasket.

Reference the pictures and text below for additional info:
Attachments
This picture shows the tangent plane of the record groove where the needle sits using the sheet of paper. This is how the reproducer is angled originally, notice how far it is from being parallel with the tangent plane. This is why these corrections must be done in the first place, that poor alignment is reducing performance and creating record wear.
This picture shows the tangent plane of the record groove where the needle sits using the sheet of paper. This is how the reproducer is angled originally, notice how far it is from being parallel with the tangent plane. This is why these corrections must be done in the first place, that poor alignment is reducing performance and creating record wear.
2013-07-01 17.35.03.jpg (99.98 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
This shows the original angle at the beginning of a record, note that the needle is digging into the inner groove wall.
This shows the original angle at the beginning of a record, note that the needle is digging into the inner groove wall.
2013-07-01 14.03.19.jpg (85.94 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
This is the original angle at the end of a record, still far from parallel.
This is the original angle at the end of a record, still far from parallel.
2013-07-01 14.06.14.jpg (97.19 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
This is the silicone used for the gasket, actually an indoor/outdoor sealent DAP DYNAFLEX230-color Dark Bronze.
This is the silicone used for the gasket, actually an indoor/outdoor sealent DAP DYNAFLEX230-color Dark Bronze.
2013-07-02 13.25.35.jpg (100.7 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
Here is the paper mold that I created for the flange gasket, it was formed around the brass ring. (Despite saying 10 degrees on the mold, it was really 12)
Here is the paper mold that I created for the flange gasket, it was formed around the brass ring. (Despite saying 10 degrees on the mold, it was really 12)
2013-07-02 15.17.17.jpg (97.37 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
After filling the mold with silicone
After filling the mold with silicone
2013-07-02 16.16.46.jpg (101.47 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
Here is the finished gasket. It may not be the most beautiful thing when finished, but it works.
Here is the finished gasket. It may not be the most beautiful thing when finished, but it works.
2013-07-03 22.28.16.jpg (96.73 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
This picture is similar to the first one, but this is after installing the custom flange gasket. The reproducer is very close to being parallel with the groove's tangent plane.
This picture is similar to the first one, but this is after installing the custom flange gasket. The reproducer is very close to being parallel with the groove's tangent plane.
2013-07-04 00.21.58.jpg (95.22 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
The reproducer at the start of a record, notice how close the alignment is compared to the original picture above.
The reproducer at the start of a record, notice how close the alignment is compared to the original picture above.
2013-07-04 00.19.20.jpg (101.49 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
The reproducer at the end of a record, tracking much better than originally.
The reproducer at the end of a record, tracking much better than originally.
2013-07-04 00.19.46.jpg (99.02 KiB) Viewed 3694 times
Last edited by Player-Tone on Thu Jul 04, 2013 4:03 pm, edited 2 times in total.
-Mike

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Player-Tone
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by Player-Tone »

-Additional pictures:
Attachments
The reproducer's sound hole is not constricted at all, the offset starts from the outside so it can align with the reproducer's center hole on the inside.
The reproducer's sound hole is not constricted at all, the offset starts from the outside so it can align with the reproducer's center hole on the inside.
2013-07-04 15.38.09.jpg (99.95 KiB) Viewed 3628 times
This is what the finished gasket looks like.
This is what the finished gasket looks like.
2013-07-04 00.22.23.jpg (94.69 KiB) Viewed 3693 times
This shows the clearence of the tone-arm when folded back, it is close but does not touch.
This shows the clearence of the tone-arm when folded back, it is close but does not touch.
2013-07-04 00.23.00.jpg (88.25 KiB) Viewed 3693 times
Last edited by Player-Tone on Thu Jul 04, 2013 3:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.
-Mike

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Player-Tone
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by Player-Tone »

-For easy comparison:
Attachments
Before:
Before:
2013-07-01 17.35.03.jpg (99.98 KiB) Viewed 3693 times
After:
After:
2013-07-04 00.21.58.jpg (95.22 KiB) Viewed 3693 times
-Mike

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Player-Tone
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by Player-Tone »

-End of original post-

WARNING: This gasket is patent pending. It's ok to make this gasket for your own personal use, however it is not ok to produce this gasket for sale or distribution without proper permission.

Mike

_________________________________________________________________________________________
Last edited by Player-Tone on Mon Jul 22, 2013 7:27 pm, edited 8 times in total.
-Mike

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FloridaClay
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by FloridaClay »

Very clever!

Clay
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Orthophonic
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by Orthophonic »

Great way of doing this! Victor had a recall in the Orthophonic era which addressed this very same topic. Their solution was to provide crooks bent to a different angle or to have the motor board and motor sent back and re-drilled to place the sound box at a more favorable angle. Obviously these were the electric types of motors.

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De Soto Frank
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by De Soto Frank »

Is there any noticeable change in tone quality with the revised geometry ?

:coffee:
De Soto Frank

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Player-Tone
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by Player-Tone »

I have noticed improved tone, especially on my loud military march records and opera records. The sound is more rich and crisp, but that's just an ear's judgement-I don't have fancy equipment to measure the exact difference in tone.

I did notice that I can now play some of my badely worn records which originally slowed the single spring VV-50 motor due to groove friction. The new angle reduces friction on the groove wall allowing the worn record to play properly.
-Mike

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Lucius1958
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by Lucius1958 »

Now if one could do something like that on an Exhibition….

Bill

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Duchesne
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Re: Improve tracking & reduce record wear on Victrola No.2

Post by Duchesne »

Wonderful! Thanks for this Player-Tone!

I can make one of those for my Silvertone portable! Duct tape just isn't good on a hot sunny day.

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