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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 4:30 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:36 pm
Posts: 19
Location: New Kent County, Virginia, USA
Here are the pictures of the motor frame pieces. I would say that this is not a Garrard motor, unless they had an American arm of the company that made them here.


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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 5:53 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Sun May 27, 2012 2:38 pm
Posts: 873
Location: United Kingdom
That's a Heinemann "Flyer" motor, same as is fitted to my American Columbia 163 portable.


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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:05 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:36 pm
Posts: 19
Location: New Kent County, Virginia, USA
Are replacement parts readily available? Also, is this a good quality motor?


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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:38 pm 
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Victor III
Joined: Sun May 27, 2012 2:38 pm
Posts: 873
Location: United Kingdom
F_R_Parker1 wrote:
Are replacement parts readily available? Also, is this a good quality motor?


I read a review of the 163 some time ago, and it said that the "Flyer"motor was underpowered, but I find no fault with mine, it plays one and a half 12" records with a single winding, no trouble. As for the availability of spares, I can't advise on that, as American machines are rare as hen's teeth over this side of the pond, but as Columbia machines seem to be plentiful in the USA, I would think one of the well-known suppliers of spares over there will be able to help.


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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:49 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:36 pm
Posts: 19
Location: New Kent County, Virginia, USA
Are these suppliers listed in the "suppliers" section of the forum?


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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 7:18 pm 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:36 pm
Posts: 19
Location: New Kent County, Virginia, USA
While we're at it, something does not seem right with the spring circled in red. Should it connect to something else to stop the winding gear from traversing freely (if that makes sense)?


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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 4:19 am 
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Victor III
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F. Depero, "Grammofono", 1923.
Joined: Thu Feb 24, 2011 4:19 am
Posts: 998
Location: Italy
Indeed it looks very crude. Original no-return coils are wounded up much tighter than that, and they are also attached to the motor cast with nice angles in specific points. The hook on the right might be OK but the way in which the top end of the coil is locked against the cast of the motor is definitely too ugly to be an original part.

For some reason finding pictures of these motors seems exceptionally hard. However, I've found a picture of a unit (which may or may not be similar to yours, I'm unsure) from which it seems that your motor may be missing an entire gear of parts that operated this task. It also seems that the shaft of your unit still bears the signs of where these parts operated. But of course this is just educated guessing.


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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 11:51 am 
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Victor Jr
Joined: Thu Apr 25, 2019 2:36 pm
Posts: 19
Location: New Kent County, Virginia, USA
Other than the fact that it is a two spring motor, yes it is rather similar. As for missing gears, everything appeared to be in the proper position when I opened it for the first time. The gears are not visible from this side of the motor. As for the broken arbor rivet, it is a standard ¼ inch in diameter shaft, so I should just be able to order a new one, pull the old rivet out with my vice and pliers, and tap the new one in with a ball peen hammer. Now while I understand how these "no return" springs work in principle, I don't understand how it would work on this machine. What would it anchor itself to, a screw of sorts? And is it possible to simply wind a new one using the same type of wire without any special machinery? All I am really privy to is a car garage, and no special tools at that.


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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:05 pm 
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Victor Monarch
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Needle Tins are Addictive
Joined: Fri Jul 09, 2010 8:32 pm
Posts: 4537
Location: Belmont, North Carolina
"And is it possible to simply wind a new one using the same type of wire without any special machinery?"

THAT answer is NO, you can't wind your own without special equipment. Those springs are tempered and can't be bent... However, spring winders are available, just too pricey to justify making your own.
https://www.advancecarmover.com/complet ... utfit.aspx
https://www.flexbar.com/products/univer ... ing-winder

As a practical matter, it would be better and cheaper to locate a replacement spring or even an entire motor...

George Vollema of Great Lakes Antique Phonographs is a good choice for finding parts - http://www.victroladoctor.com


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"The phonograph† is not of any commercial value."
Thomas Alva Edison - Comment to his assistant, Samuel Insull.

"No one needs a Victrola XX, a Perfected Graphophone Type G, or whatever you call those noisy things."
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 Post subject: Re: How to get Columbia 161 portable out of its case?
PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 7:53 pm 
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Victor V
I've got both kinds of music--classical & rag-time.
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:39 am
Posts: 2046
Location: South Carolina
My brother (an accomplished amateur blacksmith & inventor) has wound the springs to homemade steel traps, on the coil spring pattern. A mandrel and a vise and some music wire is what it takes. In this case I think it would be better to find a spare spring mechanism.

Good luck. This is a tough restoration so far but hopefully it will go well.


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