Washers at the bottom of HMV 102 spring case, Russian copy?

[nostalgia]

I find these autobrakes tricky to recognize, Barry. I thought my pictured green 102 had the autobrake No. 6, listed on photo 7.25 ( to the right) on page 209 in "The Book"? To me this autobrake, and the one on my green 102 looks similar.
Yes, I felt already the autobrake fitted on my green 102, will not fit on my red 102, the autobrake needed for my red 102 must be the same as gramophoneshane has on his blue 102. But what is the number on this autobrake? I do not recognize it from any of the autobrake photos in "The book".

[Phono48]

Humble apologies!! The autobrake on your green machine is indeed a No.6. Don't know what possessed me, put it down to a senior moment! It is not the standard one, though, it was made to fit onto the raised platform above the motor. You do need the one empigramophone has shown. The No.6 in "the book" is only shown as a "Conversion kit" presumably made to replace the very unreliable No.5. (7.20a page 29) Sorry again for confusing you!

Barry

[nostalgia]

The majority of us in this hobby have our senior moments, Barry;) No apologies needed. So my autobrake is a no 6 on the green 102, but not the standard one, okay. Then we hopefully agree that the autobrake no. 6 on photo 7.25 (page 209) in "the book" is also not a standard one, since I can't see any difference between this autobrake and the autobrake on my green model, since both these 102 models have raised platforms around the motor. I also assume the "conversion kit" autobrake no. 6 is the same autobrake as the non standard one you mention in the same message. (Non standard = conversion kit autobrake.)
Do we know the number/name on the autobrake I need for my red model 102? Is it a variety of the no.6 autobrake, or even..the standard one, since we now have talked about the "not standard" one? And maybe an even trickier question, at least for me at this stage in my "career", do the autobrake I need only fit to a certain motor...270D/271C..D?
And Barry...I am sure you was referring to Gramophoneshane..and not Epigramophone..this time.:;)

[gramophoneshane]

Here's some new px. Hopefully these are a bit clearer.
The first is the brake installed, the second just shows the 4 screw hole positions with the brake and auto-brake selector plate removed, and the next 2 are of course the top and under side of the brake removed.

[Phono48]

Then we hopefully agree that the autobrake no. 6 on photo 7.25 (page 209) in "the book" is also not a standard one, since I can't see any difference between this autobrake and the autobrake on my green model, since both these 102 models have raised platforms around the motor. I also assume the "conversion kit" autobrake no. 6 is the same autobrake as the non standard one you mention in the same message. (Non standard = conversion kit autobrake.)
Do we know the number/name on the autobrake I need for my red model 102? Is it a variety of the no.6 autobrake
And Barry...I am sure you was referring to Gramophoneshane..and not Epigramophone..this time.:;)

Yes, we agree that the two brakes, yours on the green 102 and that shown in the book are the same. The conversion kit was to replace the unreliable No.5. You need a standard No.6, as shown by Gramophoneshane (with apologies for getting his name wrong, another senior moment!)

Barry

[gramophoneshane]

No need to apologize Barry.
I can assure you I've been called far worse things than Epigramophone in my life lol.

[nostalgia]

Gramophoneshane, a very deep thank you for disassembling your blue 102, to show the autobrake in detail. This is actually the first time I see this autobrake on a photo too! Now I will know what to look for, to put my red 102 back in the shape it deserves. If you ever read my response here, can I ask..is there an escutcheon around the winding key on this model? On my red 102, there is no escutcheon, only the carved wood.
Barry, thank you also for all help and responses, I know will remember well these different autobrakes, the best way to learn is of course to discuss it, and even be able to see the different models in photos, ...and adding a situation where you need to dive into it when servicig a motor. There is no doubt, one learns by trying, and failing..and finally hopefully succeeding.
Soundgen, also big thanks to you, of course, for cutting through here, and also pinpointing the origin of the motor of this gramophone etc.
I am very grateful, thank you again all of you.

[Phono48]

is there an escutcheon around the winding key on this model? On my red 102, there is no escutcheon, only the carved wood.

No, there's no escutcheon on this 102E. To be picky, the escutcheon is the bit that goes on the outside if the case, so I presume you mean the curved shield that covers the handle on the motorboard on some HMV 101s. There is nothing inside or out on this model. As you no doubt know, your machine is on the back cover of the book.

Barry

[nostalgia]

Thank you, Barry. I could have checked the photo on the back cover of "the book" myself. When writing here I forgot that my machine was pictured there ( even if I know that very well), and also the photo is showing the area I asked for. No escutcheon, and as you say...even more correct for this model with no hole in the case for the winding key, no curved shield around the winding key area on the motorboard. I am happy to be corrected this way, it is the best way to learn the small nuances of the gramophone "encyclopedia".

[gramophoneshane]

Last of all in 1948 came the 102 E and H, which had the motorboard level with the case, no panel in the lid with the HMV logo on it, and no winding escutcheon.

Is it known whether the D and E were being manufactured at the same time, or did stock piled machines receive their serial/date number just prior to leaving the factory?

I ask this because nostalgia's 102E and my 102D are both dated 1950 (B/14), and mine has an escutcheon of sorts (the chrome plated U shaped metal piece held in by a single screw in the winder cut-out of the case), a sunken motor board, and no panel in the lid.