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 Post subject: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 10:22 am 
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Victor O
I'm Steve
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:15 am
Posts: 89
Sorry for a redundant question, but I'm getting ready to put a victrola back together, and was wondering what the best material would be to seal the cast horn to the wooden horn. This will be the first time I've done this.

I've read through previous posts, and have seen: plumber's grease, vaseline, beeswax, and caulk.

If doing beeswax, would you melt it first in a pot, and quickly coat the horn before attaching? or just soften it up and apply? I worry about getting it thick enough before it hardens. Also of making a mess!

My first instinct was to use the material from a toilet wax ring. It's pretty soft, and looks like the stuff I scraped off the horn when I disassembled.

Also, I had planed on coating the other metal-to-wood surfaces with Johnson's paste wax. One of my favorites.

Thanks :)


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 12:08 pm 
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Victor IV
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Keep'em well oiled
Joined: Mon Dec 18, 2017 2:51 am
Posts: 1025
Location: Madrid, Spain
I've used successfully a custom made felt joint, cut using the metal horn side as a guide. I cut first the external contour, then glued the felt to the horn throat, and after dried, I cut out the inner contour using a sharp cutter against the internal contour of the metal. Then made the holes for the bolts and done!
The felt joint introduces a 0.5mm space that was not there before, be careful when reassembling the horn into the case.
Sealing the joint after assembled, using wax or any similar substance applied to the external contour of the joint, all around and leaving no gaps will also work, and has the advantage of no extra room.
In my case, I also used a felt joint to join the tonearm base to the external side of the case, and also between the metal horn throat and the inner wooden part of the case.
Mine is an hmv style iii tabletop, very similar to a Victrola VI, for info.
Inigo


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 1:39 pm 
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Victor V
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Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:01 pm
Posts: 2444
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania
If it were my project, I'd use Mortite rope caulk, widely available from any number of local and internet sources, such as your local hardware and building supply, or Amazon. There's even a "woodtone"variety, in addition to the usual grey. The advantage to Mortite is that it remains flexible, seals really well, and is paintable. It's also reversible, i.e., easy to remove. It will dampen any unwanted vibrations between metal and wood, too.


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 7:21 pm 
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Victor O
I'm Steve
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:15 am
Posts: 89
Thanks for the tips! I couldn't find mortite at my Ace, so I went ahead and tried the wax ring (I'd like to try it out next time though). Messy, sticky, and a lot of excess to clean up! But I think it makes a nice seal. The only think I'm worried about is attracting dust.

I also put down a sheet of fiber gasket material to add a layer of protection.


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:34 pm 
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Victor II
Joined: Sat Aug 11, 2018 12:14 pm
Posts: 235
Location: Plainfield, NJ
Henry wrote:
If it were my project, I'd use Mortite rope caulk, widely available from any number of local and internet sources, such as your local hardware and building supply, or Amazon. There's even a "woodtone"variety, in addition to the usual grey. The advantage to Mortite is that it remains flexible, seals really well, and is paintable. It's also reversible, i.e., easy to remove. It will dampen any unwanted vibrations between metal and wood, too.


I haven’t used it for this purpose, but Mortite came to mind as a possibility. It has been a long time since I used the stuff, but it was my father’s go-to material for caulking and sealing; he always had a box of the stuff around. It does have the advantage that it stays pliable and can be easily removed. I’ll have to try it in this kind of application.

Bill


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 8:36 pm 
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Victor V
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Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:01 pm
Posts: 2444
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania
Looks like you did a real neat job there, tesch. How did you seal around the sides and bottom?


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:19 pm 
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Victor O
I'm Steve
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:15 am
Posts: 89
Henry wrote:
Looks like you did a real neat job there, tesch. How did you seal around the sides and bottom?


Thanks!

I took it apart and cleaned all the old material away. Then I slathered the wax on the edge of the wooden horn, and fitted the cast piece on. I put WAY too much on at first, which was a pain to clean up, but after some adjusting, I was able to screw it back together. Then it was just a matter of squeezing as much wax as I could with my finger for a good fit.


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Wed Sep 16, 2020 9:50 pm 
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Victor V
I've got both kinds of music--classical & rag-time.
Joined: Fri Oct 06, 2017 11:39 am
Posts: 2197
Location: South Carolina
The idea of a wax ring to make a new horn seal is absolutely great. Thanks for sharing this! Here I was thinking I had to go find a beehive.


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 10:23 am 
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Victor V
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Joined: Thu Jan 08, 2009 12:01 pm
Posts: 2444
Location: Allentown, Pennsylvania
VanEpsFan1914 wrote:
The idea of a wax ring to make a new horn seal is absolutely great. Thanks for sharing this! Here I was thinking I had to go find a beehive.

Drifting O/T here: At least those wax toilet seals are good for something besides sealing toilets. For their intended purpose, they are far inferior to the newer seals made of neoprene. I speak from experience, and will never use wax rings again.


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 Post subject: Re: Victrola horn seal material
PostPosted: Thu Sep 17, 2020 11:51 am 
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Victor O
I'm Steve
Joined: Sat Apr 07, 2018 9:15 am
Posts: 89
Henry wrote:
VanEpsFan1914 wrote:
The idea of a wax ring to make a new horn seal is absolutely great. Thanks for sharing this! Here I was thinking I had to go find a beehive.

Drifting O/T here: At least those wax toilet seals are good for something besides sealing toilets. For their intended purpose, they are far inferior to the newer seals made of neoprene. I speak from experience, and will never use wax rings again.


I concur. It's actually the memories of having a toilet slip on one that gave me the idea. I have a lot left over. I think I'll put it in a tin, might be good for lubricating screws.


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