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Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Thu Jan 07, 2021 8:38 pm
by condenser
Those of us interested in the somewhat later 3-speed record player type machines have probably faced the issue of vulcanised idler wheels - where the rubber has gone rock hard. Some years ago I used a company in USA that did good work -
http://turntablebasics.com/idlerwheels.html
I tried them again in 2020. I sent them an idler wheel from an HMV autochanger for restoration, pre-paid as per instructions on their site. I sent it in September. There has been no response, no wheel returned, no answers to emails. I conclude that they are no longer in business, but you cannot tell that from their web site.
I suggest that none of us use that site again, unless you can make contact with them in advance. They accepted my payment but I have received no refund.
Does anyone know of a firm that can and actually does refurbish these wheels? Unfortunately I do not have the HMV wheel, as it has not been returned, so I am going to have to modify something else. The HMV one had a built-on axle rod about 2" long, not like a normal idler.
Thanks if you have any suggestions.
Regards
David Evans
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Fri Jan 08, 2021 5:23 pm
by pallophotophone
condenser wrote:Those of us interested in the somewhat later 3-speed record player type machines have probably faced the issue of vulcanised idler wheels - where the rubber has gone rock hard. Some years ago I used a company in USA that did good work -
http://turntablebasics.com/idlerwheels.html
I tried them again in 2020. I sent them an idler wheel from an HMV autochanger for restoration, pre-paid as per instructions on their site. I sent it in September. There has been no response, no wheel returned, no answers to emails. I conclude that they are no longer in business, but you cannot tell that from their web site.
I suggest that none of us use that site again, unless you can make contact with them in advance. They accepted my payment but I have received no refund.
Does anyone know of a firm that can and actually does refurbish these wheels? Unfortunately I do not have the HMV wheel, as it has not been returned, so I am going to have to modify something else. The HMV one had a built-on axle rod about 2" long, not like a normal idler.
Thanks if you have any suggestions.
Regards
Try
http://www.kenselectronics.com/lists/phonodrive.htm When I rebuilt a wire recorder for use at Syracuse University, this company rebuilt a drive puck for a Webster Chicago machine.
Best Of Luck !!!
David Evans
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Fri Jan 08, 2021 6:15 pm
by OrthoFan
Hi David:
Out of curiosity, I did a little googling and found that the site's owner is Tim or Timothy Morse --
https://www.google.com/search?lr=&as_qd ... CAw&uact=5 -- and it appears that others have complained.
As you know, except for the fax number and email/mailing address, the website provides no contact information for him which is always a bad sign. I DID spot some phone numbers associated with Tim Morse, and his address, and tried two, but neither seems to be working. If you want to check it out, here's a link --
https://www.truepeoplesearch.com/find/m ... hy/area/mn
It's a good idea, nowerdays, to always try to get recommendations. This forum is an excellent starting play, going forward, for questions about any type of phonograph related repair.
Good luck,
OrthoFan
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Sun Jan 10, 2021 3:52 pm
by Herman
condenser wrote:
Does anyone know of a firm that can and actually does refurbish these wheels? Unfortunately I do not have the HMV wheel, as it has not been returned, so I am going to have to modify something else. The HMV one had a built-on axle rod about 2" long, not like a normal idler.
Thanks if you have any suggestions.
Regards
David Evans
Here is a link to another option for idlers.
http://www.terrysrubberrollers.com/
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Sat Jan 23, 2021 7:26 pm
by donniej
If you can provide detailed specifications, I can make them out of silicone rubber. As long as specs can be provided, I can also machine a brass inner bushing.
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Tue Jun 15, 2021 1:40 pm
by mrrgstuff
I had a couple of goes at building idler wheels:
https://youtu.be/6NEZzPQCl00
https://youtu.be/SiXVPvEIxME
The 2nd attempt on the lathe produced one I am still using. Probably could do with a brass bushing though for longer life.
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2021 1:20 am
by condenser
I adapted one from a much later American record changer - had to make a spindle/axle for it, as the HMV one had a built-in axle and most of course rotate on a fixed axle. Had to turn down the diameter of the rubber disc and it works fine now.
Thank you to everyone for your replies, links to people who can refurbish these items etc. All most useful information, which I shall note down carefully.
The next problem of course is how does one make a British HMV (or any British player) run at the correct speed on Canadian 60 Hz mains? We have been working on that too. We use an Arduino processor programmed to run at 50 Hz and amplify it with high power MOSFET power switches running from 115 volts dc and then a 2:1 transformer to increase the o/p voltage to 230 volts at 50 Hz. Still working on the design, as the unit runs rather hot and needs a heat sink and small blower fan, but it basically works fine!
Sorry to go into electronics on the TMF!
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2021 1:28 am
by condenser
OrthoFan wrote: ↑Fri Jan 08, 2021 6:15 pm
Hi David:
Out of curiosity, I did a little googling and found that the site's owner is Tim or Timothy Morse --
https://www.google.com/search?lr=&as_qd ... CAw&uact=5 -- and it appears that others have complained.
As you know, except for the fax number and email/mailing address, the website provides no contact information for him which is always a bad sign. I DID spot some phone numbers associated with Tim Morse, and his address, and tried two, but neither seems to be working. If you want to check it out, here's a link --
https://www.truepeoplesearch.com/find/m ... hy/area/mn
It's a good idea, nowerdays, to always try to get recommendations. This forum is an excellent starting play, going forward, for questions about any type of phonograph related repair.
Good luck,
OrthoFan
All very useful advice - thank you! The funny thing is that, two days ago, my original HMV idler wheel arrived in my post box in a small carboard box nicely re-rubbered! No paperwork, no message, nothing but the wheel and packaging plastic worms. Very odd! I do now have it back, but have not fitted it yet - see below! Only a year or so after I sent it to them.........
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Sun Jul 04, 2021 9:51 am
by Inigo
For the frequency change there was the old solution, to machine a different motor brass turret with the corresponding diameters for 33/45/78, and let the motor run at its natural speed dictated by the mains freq. You replaced the American turret by the european one et voilà! It was a very common solution provided when Americans came to Europe in the fifties. Lots of gramophone repair shops made this for their American customers' record players to make them work right at 50hz! They didn't need anything else! As the frequency herein is lower, you need a turret with slightly larger diameters to cope with the lower motor speed. Exactly the same proportion but inverse : the new sizes are the same of the old turret multiplied by 6/5. Then you get the right speed at the idler wheel and turntable.
Re: Rebuilding rubber idler wheels
Posted: Thu Aug 05, 2021 3:48 pm
by TonyJ
For idler wheels for more "modern day" phonographs, Gary Stork at the Voice of Music is the go-to guy. In the future he may be able to help you out.
https://www.thevoiceofmusic.com/default.asp