Victor Victrola Speed Control Arm

[Sherazhyder]

A friend of mine has brought me a Victor Victrola four spring motor for repair probably belonging to XVII. I am a simple hobbyist accustomed to work with HMV or Swiss made machines. Therefore I am stuck to find that a spring on speed control arm is missing thus the arm freely moves left and right. It can easily collide with the governor springs and break them. He has bought a spring on the eBay but none of us knows how the spring is installed in the machine. Any other local technical support is not available too.

I will appreciate if I get a step wise guidance for installation of the spring on the speed control arm.
Thanks and best regards
Sheraz

[Inigo]

A photo of the motor would help to settle things right... At least we'd know which motor is it, and what speed control it has...

[Sherazhyder]

A photo of the motor would help to settle things right... At least we'd know which motor is it, and what speed control it has...

Here is the motor. You can see the regulator housing is missing and I am going to buy it. The spring arm link
has a broken spring and I do not know how does it work; how is it taken out and how is this spring replaced and arm installed in the motor. Your help will mean a lot. Thanks and regards
Sheraz

[Sherazhyder]

I want to add that the arm is loose inside the motor chassis. Probably the spring will tighten it. I have unscrewed the external part of the arm but the part inside the chassis though freely moves too and fro but does not come out. I have tried to take it out from both sides. But it gets stuck somewhere and I have not tried to force it out.

Is there a manual or write for me to understand how the arm with a kind of leather brake at its one end work with the speed regulator? Once I understand it , I will be able to fix it. Thanks
Regards
Sheraz

[Inigo]

I will send you this evening some questions and photos of an example of what I believe you're referring to, plus a solution for the spring which works far better...
EDIT
the former was in the belief that you referred to the speed measurement part, missing from your photos.
Now for the speed regulation part.
But first of all: to extract the short part of the arm (the L shaped with the leather pad at the end) you must first extract the governor complete, unscrewing the two bearings at both ends until you can move them away from the axis, then take the governor by the brass disc and extract it carefully.
The L speed regulation arm is extracted towards the motor, just it is why you must remove the governor first. The spring I don't remember well how is attached, but when properly attached must maintain the pad against the governor disc.

[Sherazhyder]

Thanks for your note. I have tried to remove the governor but its bearings have probably never been taken out and are jammed. I will use some lubricant spray to loosen it. Then it might come out.

What do you think about the board and machine? Is it not of Victrola XVI?

Will you please further enlighten me on the role of regulator (on the chasis) and of the arm with leather brake? Which of the two is tied to the adjustment screw and to the speed indicator? Any manual or photographs will certainly help. Your assistance means a lot to me since this is the first time I am trying to work on a Victrola. Thanks and best regards
Sheraz

[JerryVan]

Thanks for your note. I have tried to remove the governor but its bearings have probably never been taken out and are jammed. I will use some lubricant spray to loosen it. Then it might come out.

What do you think about the board and machine? Is it not of Victrola XVI?

Will you please further enlighten me on the role of regulator (on the chasis) and of the arm with leather brake? Which of the two is tied to the adjustment screw and to the speed indicator? Any manual or photographs will certainly help. Your assistance means a lot to me since this is the first time I am trying to work on a Victrola. Thanks and best regards
Sheraz

The speed indicator mechanism is not there, as you say. That doesn't mean it's missing. Not all motors/phonographs were necessarily fitted with speed indicators.

The governor end bearings will be frozen in place from old, dried oils. Penetrating oils may help, but gently warming up the motor frame will allow the old lubricant to melt and release the end bearings.

As to the arm with the leather pad... Your leather pad is missing. The bit of leather is supposed to be clamped/pinched in the forked end of the speed regulator arm. A small piece of leather from a treadle powered sewing machine belt is usually ideal.

The spring that keeps tension on the speed control arm is there, but appears to be badly distorted. You'll need to reshape it so that at one end, it wraps around the control arm and the other end should hook onto the motor frame. The spring tension should act to push the leather pad against the governor friction plate.

The governor itself has been somewhat trashed due to previous attempts to repair broken governor springs. You'll need to do some of your "measuring tape" repairs here.

[Sherazhyder]

You are certainly right but I think that the speed indicator mechanism was once there as the motor chassis has holes for its screw. The motor board (see the picture attached) has also cut out for the speed indicator.

Thanks for your piece of advice about oiling and warming for unfreezing the bearings. Certainly I will follow your directions.

As to the arm with the leather pad, the arm itself is damaged and yes the leather pad is missing. Ok I will pinch in a small piece of leather there the forked end of the speed regulator arm . I can try springs of various sizes on the speed control arm but how precisely it wraps around the control arm and how the other end is tied to the body ? I have never seen it before so I need some pictures.

Yes I will rebuild the governor.

Thanks and please advise further at your convenience.
Best regards
Sheraz

[Inigo]

And before removal of the governor, please, make yourself sure that there is no tension in the main springs and the motor is completely run down.

[Sherazhyder]

Thanks Inigo ! I will exactly do it as advised.

I have taken out both parts of the arm link. It seems damaged for the hump in the center and a hole on one side. I guess this requires replacement. I will buy both the arm and spring. But commissioning the spring will be challenging for me without any idea of it. Your assistance will be of immense value to move further on this project. Thanks