Chinoiserie gramophone for auction in UK.

[epigramophone]

https://www.the-saleroom.com/en-gb/auct ... c333c6efc8

Unusual in having a red ground instead of the more common black, this machine is complete with it's original stand.
See how the dozy auctioneers have placed it on the stand the wrong way around!

[CarlosV]

It is interesting that even the grill cloth is painted with Chinese motifs. The hardware looks like generic parts, the machine was likely made by a furniture manufacturer.

[epigramophone]

I have my doubts about the originality of the grille cloth. Although China does have a very small population of wild elephants (estimated to be less than 200 in the 1980's) I think the cloth is more likely to be of Indian manufacture.

[Steve]

There is something distinctly odd about this. The internal red paint is incredibly poorly done and amateurish and yet it's survival would indicate its original? You would expect the internal parts to have worn better than the external, for example, so why repaint the inside and how could anyone match that red colour somehow? Red is the worst colour for fading.

By contrast the outside is much better although the winder is doubtfully original and the door is missing a handle. Meanwhile the other door handle appears to be unpainted? It is very strange but as has already been pointed out, it contains some generic parts inside.

The grille cloth is definitely not original and the frame around it does not even support it properly. The cloth appears to be in two parts?

From a distance it looks like quite a collectors piece. Up close it just looks like the typical rubbish expected in a UK Saleroom in the current climate, which is a pity.

[soundgen]

Hammer price £500

[travisgreyfox]

I do not think I would pay £10 for this phonograph. Kind of tacky IMO.

[epigramophone]

After failing to sell on eBay it is back at a much reduced but still optimistic price :

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/315728702244

[Curt A]

What's actually wrong with it? Chinese production in the nineteen teens was not necessarily high quality...
Maybe if the base paint was black and the designs were embellished with gold, you would view it differently?
Just sayin'...

The only other custom red cabinet that I've seen was a Douglas cabinet... upright with scenes painted on it and a Victor horn on top. Also, it's not necessary to have herds of elephants in your country to use them as a design element...

Screenshot 2024-09-06 at 5.59.45 PM.png (263.92 KiB) Viewed 1867 times

[epigramophone]

The revised listing shows that the elephant design grille cloth has been replaced with plain red material. With no decorative fretwork to support it, this is not an improvement.
In the UK, ornate unbranded machines such as this are sometimes referred to as "Furniture Shop Gramophones". The unfinished cabinet would have been sent to specialist, possibly Chinese, decorators for painting.
The red ground should make it more desirable than the more commonly found black, but it is still overpriced.

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/315728702244

[jamiegramo]

The former elephant fabric was modern probably from India or Thailand. Not really correct and it was folded to fit.

I agree the latest fabric is not much of an improvement as it is too plain and needs ideally a chinoiserie fretwork. Is the original fretwork missing or is the seller hiding the fact the horn has gone?