The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

The lacquer-coated "instantaneous" discs, such as used with the Wilcox "Recordio" cannot be played on an acoustic machine, let alone with a steel needle on a vintage electric machine. Plus, they are highly flammable...


So, we need the following:

1) Compound recipe for say, 1925 vintage Victor / Columbia / Brunswick discs.

2) Recording lathe with correct stylus and pitch for 78 rpm non-micro groove.

3) Plant / jobber to press them.


In my developing vision for this, the source music would come from modern analog or digital masters, mixed to "mono" ( a "stereo" pressing would be pointless ), perhaps sending the source through a choice of a couple of EQ patterns, to approximate: pure acoustic "horn-recording", early Western Electric, early Columbia, what have you.

It would be worth experimenting with a modern "flat" EQ ( utilizing modern high-end mics), and sending that direct to the master.

None of this seems insurmountable, given the limited technology and manufacturing processes available to the folks who were doing this 80-100 years ago... ?

I expect with lateral mono cutting that a modern cutting stylus can cut deep enough into a lacquer to produce grooves with sufficient width near the top to accomodate 3 mil playback styli, and also permit hi-fi playback with modern stereo styli riding lower in the groove.

Kryptosmaster wrote:I'd bet anything that most of the stuff used to make a shellac record is now classified as a toxin or cancer agent or something "environmentally unfriendly" so as to make the use of such materials so exhorbitantly expensive that it wouldn't be worth it to even try.

There be may be nothing particularly toxic beyond the solvent in shellac. Formulas vary, but in general the compound consists of shellac as a binder and various powdered fillers, such as rock dust, clays, and cotton flock.

Here is brief description from a book titled "Talking Wax" by Leroy Hughbanks:

The material for the records is a mixture of shellac, various clays and cotton fiber, which is known as “flock.” The formula for commercial phonograph records varies somewhat with different manufacturers but the principal ingredient is shellac which comes to us from India. The materials are mixed in a heavy rolling machine which is steam heated and, when thoroughly mixed, are passed between rolls and run out into sheets or slabs and cut into squares of suitable sizes to make the records.

Acoustic recorded and electric recorded hard 78's Will be produced within the next two years. I am working with people in pressing plants and the recording industry. We have shellac material we are going to try in record presses, that is all I can say, I am keeping the technology under my hat. Not only that me and my group are working on new Diamond Disc records as well.

edisonphonoworks wrote:Acoustic recorded and electric recorded hard 78's Will be produced within the next two years. I am working with people in pressing plants and the recording industry. We have shellac material we are going to try in record presses, that is all I can say, I am keeping the technology under my hat. Not only that me and my group are working on new Diamond Disc records as well.

I wondered if we'd be hearing from you, Shawn...


That is encouraging news, indeed !

Wonderful---very exciting indeed. I wish you every success !

At IASA (International Association of Sound and Audiovisual Archives) 2009 Annual Conference in Athens, Nikos Dionisopoulos, from Institute for Research on Music & Acoustics in Athens, Greece, talked about our topic. His conference is available in Greek (!) at http://www.iasa-web.org/iasa-2009-confe ... recordings - fortunately an abstract is readable at http://2009.iasa-web.org/abstracts_pdf/O-99.pdf - His intervention: 78 rpm records in the 21st century: “Resurrection” or a second “new life”?

I don't know him, but he thinks that producing 78s in 2009 couldn't be an affordable way. It's obviously a questionable opinion, however demonstrates that this topic isn't simply a smart collector's thought...

edisonphonoworks wrote:Acoustic recorded and electric recorded hard 78's Will be produced within the next two years. I am working with people in pressing plants and the recording industry. We have shellac material we are going to try in record presses, that is all I can say, I am keeping the technology under my hat. Not only that me and my group are working on new Diamond Disc records as well.

Fantastic. Like white on rice, all over this shall I be. New artists(?) … represses of unobtainables(?) … yes!

New hope for the possibility of hearing Max Raabe und die Palast Orchester on my Victrola !!!

De Soto Frank wrote:New hope for the possibility of hearing Max Raabe und die Palast Orchester on my Victrola !!!

Yes! And Vince, and BHS!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=f88jL13laZA