The Talking Machine Forum — For All Antique Phonographs & Recordings

Johnny Smoke wrote:Or a repro?

I thought the "Mch" abbreviation for "Machine" on these tags was the #1 sign of a repro tag- is that not correct?

gramophone-georg wrote:

Johnny Smoke wrote:Or a repro?

I thought the "Mch" abbreviation for "Machine" on these tags was the #1 sign of a repro tag- is that not correct?

Gosh, if that's true, all of mine are repros!

Just to be clear, the "Mch" abbreviation is most definitely correct for originals.

George P.

phonogfp wrote:

gramophone-georg wrote:

Johnny Smoke wrote:Or a repro?

I thought the "Mch" abbreviation for "Machine" on these tags was the #1 sign of a repro tag- is that not correct?

Gosh, if that's true, all of mine are repros!

Just to be clear, the "Mch" abbreviation is most definitely correct for originals.

George P.

Well, I was just going by the info here:
http://www.victor-victrola.com/Started2.htm

Is this not correct, then?

"Nipper on Steroids: On the left is an example of a Chinese "Rip-Off" Victor Dataplate. There are many different styles of these reproductions, and none of them have high-quality graphics. Note the abbreviation of "Machine" as "Mch" (not a common usage in the USA)."

gramophone-georg wrote:
Well, I was just going by the info here:
http://www.victor-victrola.com/Started2.htm

Is this not correct, then?

"Nipper on Steroids: On the left is an example of a Chinese "Rip-Off" Victor Dataplate. There are many different styles of these reproductions, and none of them have high-quality graphics. Note the abbreviation of "Machine" as "Mch" (not a common usage in the USA)."

You have referenced a well-respected website, but anyone can occasionally make a mistake. To be fair, Mr. Edie writes that it's "...not a common usage in the USA," implying that they do turn up sometimes.

I'm not particularly interested in Victors, but I have a "I" I've owned since 1972, a "II" I've owned since 1974, and a "III" I've owned since 2001 (but first saw in 1970). All three of these came out of houses, and all three have the abbreviated "Mch"on their data plates. There's also a Victrola "XII" here with the same abbreviation. I suppose I could simply be beating the odds, but I'd be willing to bet that the abbreviation is not unusual in the pre-1910 period in the USA...

George P.

phonogfp wrote:

gramophone-georg wrote:
Well, I was just going by the info here:
http://www.victor-victrola.com/Started2.htm

Is this not correct, then?

"Nipper on Steroids: On the left is an example of a Chinese "Rip-Off" Victor Dataplate. There are many different styles of these reproductions, and none of them have high-quality graphics. Note the abbreviation of "Machine" as "Mch" (not a common usage in the USA)."

You have referenced a well-respected website, but anyone can occasionally make a mistake. To be fair, Mr. Edie writes that it's "...not a common usage in the USA," implying that they do turn up sometimes.

I'm not particularly interested in Victors, but I have a "I" I've owned since 1972, a "II" I've owned since 1974, and a "III" I've owned since 2001 (but first saw in 1970). All three of these came out of houses, and all three have the abbreviated "Mch"on their data plates. There's also a Victrola "XII" here with the same abbreviation. I suppose I could simply be beating the odds, but I'd be willing to bet that the abbreviation is not unusual in the pre-1910 period in the USA...

George P.

Very interesting what Paul Edie had to say about the repro verses original ID tag. It very well could be a misprint missed in proof reading.
Without a doubt the Victor I ID tag this thread is about is an original tag. And ( as George said) I would guess most if not all ID tags before 1909 or 1910 use the Mch (machine) abbreviation. Out of curiosity I started looking at my Victor tags, I stopped counting at 8, they all used Mch abbreviation. Probably a better way to tell a repro tag from an original tag would be the Nipper on steroids as Paul Edie points out.

Best Regards, Larry

George P wrote, " To be fair, Mr. Edie writes that it's '...not a common usage in the USA,' implying that they do turn up sometimes."

Indeed, near the bottom of that very webpage, Mr. Edie shows a dealer decal, Stanley & Pearsall, on what he asserts his an authentic VTM product. Above that is the machine's data plate, which reads "Victor Talking Mch. Co."

Best wishes, Mark

Nipper on steroids refers to the image of Nipper used on the Chinese fakes. Just like some of the Chinese plastic Nippers that are grossly out of proportion, this tag image looks like a bloated, lumpy, poorly executed graphic.

MCH is legit on the early data plates. I have a P1, P3, M, early Vic 1, VV-XII and a VTLA, all with the Mch abbreviation...as well as data plates for another VTLA, an early 6 that are the same. I think Mch appears on all the data plates with the frilly script, because I have a couple of data plates for table top XIs that have the straight script with Machine written out, as well as an dataplate for an l-door XVI also with straight script and written out machine.

Stick to looking at Nipper to figure if it's legit or not.